A trend with college football fans is to go into semi-serious addiction withdrawal when we are smack in the middle of the off-season. Aside from recruiting, and our school’s LOI Day Signing event,  there isn’t a whole lot of timely news to discuss so we usually default to football recruiting.  Because almost any other football news that makes headlines during the off-season is usually bad news (i.e.;  injuries, transfers, firings and dismissals), and because our basketball team truly sucks, we welcome recruiting talk at this point.

And it is always interesting to converse about how hard it is to find that needle in the haystack that great recruiters do.

HIGH SCHOOL RECRUITS AND RECRUITING

That isn’t to say we should diminish the importance of recruiting one bit – it is at least half of the resources needed to get a winning football program out on the field.  So here is another and more in-depth look at the business of recruiting (and of course later developing) high school football players. The thing about a subject as big and broad as this is that one really has to chop it up into smaller pieces to even begin to understand the big picture.

All that said I’d like to clarify my stance on recruiting because I admit it can be confusing and even torque some fans off.   My look at HS recruiting is this: 95% of recruiting is the down in the trenches fighting during the long and drawn-out process of one coaching staff competing against 10-30 other good schools’ staffs to get the recruit (and his parents) to verbally agree to come to Pitt on scholarship.

That sounds rather simple however it is anything but that.  It takes a lot of time, energy and, last but certainly not least, money to field an effective recruiting team.  Blue-chip kids are targeted as early as their freshman year in high school so a school has to maintain steady and convincing contact with him for a long time to get that signed Letter of Intent.

Because of that I give that hard recruiting work credit where it is due. I look at when a recruit committed to Pitt to determine who actually ‘recruited’ that player. I fully understand it is also vitally important to keep the recruit onboard in case of a coaching change or if the recruit’s interest in Pitt wanes the closer they get to LOI signing day – but truly that is small potatoes compared to the extremely hard and long work a staff does to get that verbal commitment in the first place.

Why do I do that? Because it paints a much clearer picture when we fans start discussing how good an individual head coach (and his staff) are at getting those initial commitments, especially if we are comparing different HC’s work in this area. Also, I have held this stance for all the years I have been on the POV and The Pitt Blather before that going back to Wannstedt’s years. So this isn’t something I just decided to do to screw Pat Narduzzi (as I’m sure some of you will think).

So please keep that in mind…

Now,  that ‘look back’ stance looks like it cuts out any credit a HC gets for keeping the commitment valid and then for getting the best play they can out of that recruit as long as he plays for Pitt.  I do not believe that is the case so let me provide you with an example of what I’m talking about.

For instance, let’s look at Safety Jordan Whitehead (commit date: 6/11/14), WR Returner Quadree Henderson (10/4/14) and RB Darin Hall (8/19/14).  All three of them were recruited by and committed to Paul Chryst before Pitt’s head coaching change happened on December 26th, 2014.  For that reason I consider that the previous staff did all the extensive hard work needed in getting the kid to Pitt so they’re the result of Chryst’s recruiting efforts.

However, and this is important… I also consider them to be Pat Narduzzi’s players and with that I credit Pat Narduzzi with getting the highest level of play from their individual talents.  To me, although he didn’t actually recruit those three players, he is directly responsible for their quality play after they signed LOIs. So kudos to Narduzzi for getting the most out of those three players while they were at Pitt.

This is an important point so I’ll say it again…

In the recruiting class of 2015, which was split between Paul Chryst and Pat Narduzzi, we see these Blue Chip recruits listed below who I consider ‘Chryst recruits’ because he did the grunt work and successfully convinced them to come to Pitt… and did so in direct competition with some monster programs in the case of Whitehead and Hall especially:

W&H

But to reiterate, I also credit Narduzzi and his staff for everything these players have done out on the field as he was the HC when they first put on a Pitt uniform and started their college careers.  Again, for guys like Whitehead, Hall, Q. Henderson and, let’s say, Dane Jackson that is a real feather in Narduzzi’s Pitt ball cap.

I hope that clears some things up for in the future when we get into discussions about how good a recruiter a HC is as opposed to how well a HC gets the players to perform after they are on roster.  They are two separate animals in my opinion.

TRANSFERS IN and JUCOs 

To me these are completely different issues from the actual recruiting of HS players. Much has been discussed about transfers on here since Narduzzi became our HC  mainly because he uses the transfer system more than any other Pitt HC has in the past.

But once a recruit has signed with a different school than Pitt, played a year or two there and decides to transfer the competition for his services drops dramatically and truly is a ghost of what sort of offers he had coming out of high school.  If we take a close look at one of our recent transfers we can see this writ large.

QB Max Browne was a nationally best Rivals 5* recruit (6.1 rating) with 15 offers from Top 25 schools as some of the very best in the country wanted him back in 2013.  Just to list a few of those: USC, Alabama, Clemson, Oklahoma, Wisconsin, Michigan, Notre Dame and Stanford were all dying to get the overall #1 recruit onto their roster.  Obviously he chose USC and we know what happened there – he had a non-descript three-year run of playing 2nd string with only two starts to his credit.

So who wanted him after he decided to transfer for his last year of eligibility?  Well, in my conversation with a SoCal sportswriter last off-season it appears Browne had two serious offers other than Pitt – and he chose us.  Well, you can easily see the difference between the crazy hard work that goes into landing a blue-chip recruit out of HS  initially as opposed to his diminished worth after his initial stint at his first school.

Peterman’s , Hendrix’s and Clark’s stories mirror Browne’s also – all received great offers out of HS then almost none after their declarations of transfer.  So with that I do not consider getting transfers on roster as actually ‘recruiting’ them. Now, the fact that Narduzzi landed Peterman, Browne and those others are in their own good things he did – Peterman especially – but it’s really a separate issue than recruiting as we know it.

I look at JUCO’s the same way – even though they are listed on the recruiting websites as recruits coming to Pitt, it also isn’t the same.  So in a nutshell, when we discuss recruiting on here this is my criteria:

♣  The success of targeting a recruit, connecting with him and his family and then fighting off other, bigger, football programs to convince him to come to Pitt on scholarship stands by itself as a true indication of a HC’s recruiting prowess.

♣  Recruits who verbally commit to one HC are credited to that HC when we are discussing relative strengths and weaknesses of a HC’s recruiting.  Some credit is due for keeping the kids committed until LOI signings by that is a far cry from fighting for and landing them in the first place.

♣  Once a recruit is on campus and playing in a Pitt uniform all that the player accomplishes as far as production out on the field gets credited to the inheriting current HC.

A DEEPER LOOK

A few articles back we got into a conversation about Pat Narduzzi’s recruiting and his ability to ‘close the deal’ when recruits made an official visit to Pitt.  To remind – recruits are allowed five total official visits to schools that are paid for by the school itself, parents are allowed to visit also.  Anon pointed out that Narduzzi did indeed do well at that (actually he wrote “virtually all” which was misleading) and so I learned something new.

In that post Anon added links to Rivals’ ‘official visits’ listings.  Here they are and they are interesting to look at.

https://pittsburgh.rivals.com/visits/football/2016
https://pittsburgh.rivals.com/visits/football/2017
https://pittsburgh.rivals.com/visits/football/2018

Here are those visits broken down into the blue-chip recruits visits and signing success rates.  Interestingly enough what we see in detail below isn’t necessarily the great success rate Anon was stating it was:

Visits2

Keep in mind that the four ‘undecided’ recruits in this 2018 class may still sign with Pitt but that won’t happen – only one is still in the running and he’s a long shot so I adjusted the table to show that.

But what we see is that even in this most positive aspect of Narduzzi’s recruiting the yearly trend is downward. Less official visits are being closed on as the years progress as is the number of Blue Chip kids he’s being able to get to come on official visits.

Just the other day I wrote an article about a Pitt fan’s Excel Spreadsheet that showed all the Pitt scholarship offers from this class and also going back a few years.  This is where things get very interesting.

Given that Narduzzi and staff were successful getting kids who took official visits to Pitt to commit I started wondering if those official visits reflected a good portion of blue chip players who we were offering scholarships to and actively recruiting at the time.  Here are those results:Offers

Again you can see a distinct downward trend in Narduzzi’s being able to get these kids to Pitt on official visits and culminating in this recruiting class striking out on Blue Chip official visits and commitments completely.

That is almost hard to believe – 105 Blue Chip offers, one official visit and no Blue Chip commitments so far with only three days left. As I stated above I believe we have a decent chance at Mychale Salahuddin the 4* ATH out of Washington DC we have been dogging.  If we sign him that would be great, but even if this year’s efforts by Narduzzi and his staff have come up short in a rather dramatic way.

Because Pitt’s recruiting does not live in isolation I looked at a few other ACC schools around the same level of play in 2017 as Pitt had and charted their recruiting stats also:

Committs1

As you can see from this slice of mid-range ACC teams Pitt and Pat Narduzzi are just about average when it comes to landing all-star ratings of recruits on official visits in 2018.  However if you look at the number of visits and commitments of the Blue Chip recruits we fall to 4th in the listing.

These are a lot of statistics to digest I know, and truth be told I’m not sure they tell us anything that we didn’t already know about Pitt’s recruiting over the last three years. We know that Narduzzi started off  pretty well in his first full class of 2016 with five Blue Chip kids and a 29th ranked class. I was pretty happy with that given it was Narduzzi’s first full class.

The year after didn’t fare so well with only three Blue Chippers and us sliding to a 39th ranked class… and now in this year’s recruiting class he’s doing the worse he has since his hire with zero (0) Blue Chip recruits (so far) and continued in dropping to 46th nationally.

As you know by reading my past articles I think this is a very worrisome trend as we are in the phase of Narduzzi’s tenure where Pitt’s starting players will be majority populated with his own recruits. We saw the turnover start last season and we came up 5-7 on the season with no bowl game.  I sure don’t want that to continue, do you?

It’s easy to seperate one aspect of Narduzzi’s recruiting work like Anon did with Narduzzi’s success at getting commitments out of official visits and Narduzzi has been pretty good at that.  That is only a snapshot of his recruiting however… Sadly what Narduzzi’s been doing poorly at is getting our targeted highly ranked 4* and 5* recruits on campus for those official visits and then landing them as commitments.

If he is going to stay Pitt’s HC and expect any sort of consistent success here in the future he’s got to do much, much better in recruiting than he has to date.  Some of his own  recruits will turn out to be gems I’m sure – but if you desire, aim at, shoot and then miss at those  Blue Chip recruits the way he has been doing then what you’ll have is exactly what we are getting so far.  That is a roster full of three star recruits and at Pitt that won’t cut it for championship, or even successful, seasons.

 

 

 

227 thoughts on “An In-Depth Look at Recruiting

  1. Wow – let’s not bitch about offer sheets now folks – here we are at the very end of the recruiting cycle and instead of big recruits we get a recruit with these offers (only with the check marks in the right column).

    https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/2018/erick-hallett-69046

    Army Columbia Dartmouth Houston Liberty Louisiana-Monroe Massachusetts Memphis Nevada Prairie View A&M Southern Miss Stephen F. Austin Texas State Tulane Washington State Yale

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  2. Where do you think we should hope and expect to be rated in the recruiting rankings? I would think somewhere between 20-30 on a regular basis would be good and i think it is possible.
    I thought narduzzi did a good job the hamlin year. But last year was disappointing with all the wpial players we
    Missed on after winning 8 games a second straight year and beating ped st and clemson.
    I think it is harder than ever to recruit to pitt so i just hope that he can get to getting top 20-30 classes on a regular basis.

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  3. very informative article indeed. And a troubling trend certainly seems to be in the making.

    But, the full analysis is not complete until we see what these recent classes do in its 3rd, 4th and 5th years. After all, Chryst’s best recruiting at Pitt (the OL) matured in 2016 … 5 years after he (PC) took over at Pitt. This is understandable … RBs and WRs as a rule contribute faster than OL and QBs.

    We saw some improvement in the defense in the 2nd half of this past year, and there appears to be some experience and depth returning in almost all positions.

    Only time will tell

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  4. I think the Pete was a great place to take recruits during visits. It’s not so much anymore. Probably more coincidence than anything, though.

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    1. It probably is coincidence but it is an interesting one. It has to hurt Narduzzi on some level to show recruits an empty Pete when he’s got his own attendance issues that he probably has to deal with. If fan support is important to a recruit they likely aren’t coming to Pitt.

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  5. Good article Reed, gave Narduzzi lots of credit as usual along with a ton of charts and information to sift through. We seem to go back and forth on offer sheets and commit-able offers.

    You paint a very clear picture then topped it off with a cherry on top with your comment on the latest PITT recruits offer sheet.

    Aaron Donald was named the NFL defensive player of the year last night. << 3*

    Some juco recruits actually do commit to a certain school go away and come back to the same school so there is some oddball times when a coach puts a lot of time into the player and his family.

    I’m all for getting 4 and 5* players. I hope you all realize that is a lot harder than wishing for them when coaching at PITT.

    BTW, the Anderson grad transfer eliminated PITT when Peterson left. Many times a coach has to do a lot of hard leg work in keeping a player committed after a coaching change. They should count to the coach who ends when he signs and who coaches the kid. Lots and lots of players de-commit after the head coach leaves.

    I don’t get the rumpus about Narduzzi’s recruiting class this year as I can wait until I see how they play down the road. speaking of which.

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  6. Reed I don’t understand trends and why those are important. Therefore I am going to assume there is no problem until Pat Narduzzi leaves for his next program. Then I will blame him and fully support the new coach.

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  7. There is just as much statistical separation between a 5.6 three star and a 5.7 three star and a 5.7 three star and a 5.8 four star. I think this year’s class is OK but of course time will tell.

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  8. King Pat makes 2M + has 10 coaches and tons of support and can’t get a 4 star to save his life and we make excuses for him.

    A 4 Star is a 4 star.

    Not even asking for 5 Stars. I know that isn’t happening.

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    1. “A four star is a four star.” That’s helpful? And Aaron Donald was a three star who is the NFL’s Defensive POY. Is that helpful?

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  9. As Reed has previously stated, it’s important to never mention a recruits offer sheet. The only offer we can ever be certain a recruit ever received, is from the school he signs with.

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    1. I never said that.

      What I said, and I showed an article where it was reiterated by all three recruiting sites, is that you have to take them with a grain of salt and that they are the least accurate of any recruiting factors.

      A good rule of thumb is that if a recruit visits a big school on an official visit, or a documented campus visit, you know the offer is legit.

      I’m certainly not the only person to believe this.

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  10. As far as offer sheets go, we also need to remember that if a high school player tells an interested school that he isn’t interested in anyway shape or form. He is not going to get an offer even though the school wanted to extend one. There’s too much stuff that goes on we really don’t know.

    Not one scouting service is better than the others and until we actually can discern which offers are commit-able it’s all subjective hooey.

    Liked by 1 person

  11. That’s a great article Bernie and it tells the truth. Thanks. In fact Rivals puts a cap on how many players can be rated as 5*. To me, that’s a silly premise. If a kid is a 5* he’s a 5* regardless of how many there are.

    and just because a kid is rated a 2* doesn’t mean he’s not any good. Again, it’s subjective and please remember there are factors outside of skill that determine some of these rankings. $$, location and the school the kid ends up signing with.. among others.

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  12. If my math is close there are about 1800 and 1900 HS seniors rated 3* – 5* to fill college football rosters.

    We have been mediocre for years with some big time excitement with huge victories and also a set back or 3 from far lesser opponents. Our fan base is small and donor base smaller. The interest is not their from the ticket buying community so I don’t see 5 stars coming but hopefully things change and 1 to 3 four stars are signed.

    Many of our 3 stars are on the cusp of a fourth star. That’s the hand we are dealing with. So be it!

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  13. There will be fewer kids playing FB in the future . Read a good article the other day… shoulda copied and posted that polled parents about allowing their kids to participate in FB..polling was broken down by amount of education parents had, Caucasian or African American… interesting read… will post it if I come across it..

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  14. How one judges this PITT recruiting class made up of completely 3* players tells me how that one thinks of the the current PITT football team.

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    1. If your goal is to win the ACC championship three stars on your recruiting don’t get you close. When did King Pat coach anybody up?

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      1. psu, Clemson and Miami to name 3 and btw, Narduzzi hasn’t coached at PITT for twenty years. Hell after his first year and an eight win regular season all I heard was that he didn’t have a signature win. Now I hear how he’s lost all two of his bowl games, it’s kookier than my family.

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          1. It’s relative. People want large crowds and wins at the same time an they are PITT fans. How is this possible when the administration doesn’t cooperate? Baby steps again…. ike

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  15. Reed – As always an excellent and thought provoking article. Thanks for the outstanding effort.

    In addition to the troubling trend that Reed pointed out as far as 4* (I consider 5‘s a pipe dream) recruits visiting and signing, the downward trend in signing the precious few WPIAL players in this category is most troubling. If you can’t get some reasonable % of 4 players in your own backyard, then it sends a bad message nationally.

    I know, I know WPIAL doesn’t produce many great players anymore, but the point is still valid. If the WPIAL produces either 2 or 20, shouldn’t Pitt be able to get 40-50% of those players? If you ask me, relative attendance figures are the biggest factor here. This generation is all about personal exposure and not about playing close to family/friends. No view expressed on the message sent about the demise of the nuclear family.

    For every argument about a 3* Aaron Donald there are many more arguments about the abundance of 4* and 5* players on Alabama, Clemson, Georgia, etc.which annually compete for championships. Wisconsin is an aberration because I think they get just about every talented Wisc kid that is available, which again speaks to Pitt’s lack of hometown advantage in recruiting. BTW Wisc plays in front of huge crowds weekly.

    Personally, I think Pitt making inroads into Texas in the future is red-herring.

    HCPN and staff have worked very hard at signing 4*’s but clearly its not happening in any meaningful way and until it does we loyal fans have to accept that the best we can get are over-achieving young men who deliver 6-6 to 8-4 seasons, maybe with an occasional 9-3 or 5-7 thrown in. We on this blog will be there to watch them, but the empty seats will far out-number us.

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    1. Wisconsin used to play in front of empty stadiums until it hired the right coach, who implemented his systems and the school gave it time to manufacture. Pitt could have done this twice in the past, with Gottfried and Wannstedt, but fired both and became a laughingstock both times.

      Narduzzi has given Pitt some cred with some big wins. Time for Pitt to let a coach build and develop some continuity. Unless of course Pitt is winning only three games a season then he has to go. I don’t see that happening unless Gallagher pulls a Putt circa 1990.

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  16. Here in okie land it was reported one of OU’s running backs is transferring to Syracuse, maybe that will help Pitt to land the 4*rb.

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  17. Look, it’s no secret this HC and staff are making some major mistakes in recruiting. Hence the hire of a staff coach who’s primary job is to shake up Pitt’s recruiting…regardless of what his actual title is going to be.

    That is a step in the right direction.

    I’ve written about the mistakes and missteps this staff has had in their recruiting efforts…some fans don’t want to believe that but trust me, it is no great secret.

    I believe the above articles are facts to that statement…you can clearly see the downward trend Narduzzi is having since his 2016 class. Usually a coach gets better recruiting classes the longer he stays – especially after the good start he had with two 8 win seasons. Yet it is getting worse.

    It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to see that is a bad thing to happen and our last 5-7 season hurt us also. Right now we are at 43rd down from 35th in ’17 and 29th in ’16.

    43rd is right around what we averaged in the Graham & Chryst’s years when we were playing .500 ball. We want to be better than that and to do so we need to get as many star players onboard as possible. Pat Narduzzi and his staff members are just not good enough to win lots of games and championships without doing a whole lot better at recruiting.

    Isn’t it time we stop pointing fingers back to previous coaches for the ills of the program today? If the best recruits aren’t in the local area any longer than look farther out.. And don’t blame lack of support by the Admin for this either. This recruiting cycle Narduzzi and staff members have been flying all over by private jet – and still not landing the blue chippers they are visiting.

    They are getting the in-home visits but not the all-important official visits to campus to seal the deal…at all hardly.

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    1. Not sure why it is black and white from fans with pitt coaches-some like chryst dislike narduzzi and vice versa. I thought both have been good and liked both. But chryst was greatly helped by recruiting against ped st with sanctions pre franklin.

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  18. If you want to look at a positive sign with recruiting, it seems as though Narduzzi and staff have been offering Freshmen and Sophomores more often than normal lately. That gets them into the game earlier. But surprisingly, the majority of those 4 stars have already been offered by the big programs which puts us at a disadvantage. We need to be on these kids and offer earlier.

    Again, i think that when your staff is paid at the 50% level across all division 1 staffs, the expected results should be tempered to a top 60 recruiting class. For that reason, I personally don’t get too caught up with recruiting results. Would I like a better result, definitely. But the reality of Pitt recruiting is steeped in ineptness of the Administration.

    I think we get Salahuddin if you believe Twymans twitter. The louisville 4 star cb may be more difficult because we just got a 3 star cb for the 4th or 5th db in the class. I hope we get Brents, but it’s probably a numbers game at this point. How many more current rostered players will get the farewell and thanks speech? We will know after spring practice.

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    1. You can’t OFFER freshmen or sophomores, not allowed until after soph year.
      I am working on a Maryland kid soon….not really, but I know his Dad and will talk to him about Pitt on Tuesday.

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      1. PSU has already “communicated” with him but offer will be later this year…I will do any interference I can. Good wrestler too, squatting #500, benching over #300 as soph.

        We have another kid at our school, Junior just turned 16, wrestling #195 benching #340. Beast on the D-line. Very smart kid too.

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  19. Well let’s hope these mistakes are being corrected. We are establishing pipelines with schools. We have assistants that can sell. We have someone that can close. We have the money to make it happen. There’s no excuses now. Their has to be a correction or Pitt will continue to be mediocre. Their.

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      1. Well first one has to experience a 109 degree day (We Texans have). And the p*ssies on the Pitt staff havent yet. I agree there is no closer. But Pitt is also targeting too broad of a reach. They need to get more focused. They sent out over 100 offers to 4 stars and not 1 accepted. Narrow your search. The head coach should always be the closer. If Narduzzi cant close, he needs to be canned because he isnt that great of a coach.

        But the first sardine I want in a can wears Rockports.

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  20. Thinking the Hallett signing was a sign itself that Brents is not coming PITT’s way.

    If Pickett can be the guy next year we will see again how a good QB can make the other players and coaches look a lot better.

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  21. Reed, your articles are the best. Nothing out there can match! I’m in Central PA and spoke to families with these blue-chip recruits. We’ve had our share.

    It’s all about getting to the NFL and making big money. The college that can promote them the best and get them to the next level is where they will end up. Generally, the three stars care more about academics and opportunity after college.

    Until Pitt lightens up on their academic requirements, these elite athletes will go elsewhere. I don’t think that is going to happen and shouldn’t happen. I personally know an elite athlete who went to a major college and never took an exam. Tutors took exams in the make-up testing areas that offered special accommodations.

    This word gets out to recruits because academics aren’t important, getting to the next level is. PN is a stickler for these kids going to class and keeping up with the work. He monitors them and wants feedback from the Prof’s. We should be proud that our great university is honorable in that regard. However, the downside is that many of these blue-chips will pass on Pittt and take the easy route.

    H2P

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    1. still no excuse on why Pitt cant land even one 4 star. Pitt doesnt need 5 stars to win the Coastal. We all know what went down at NC. The NCAA only cares about is their take of the money and will turn a blind eye to cheating, fake classes and child rape. This system is flawed and will go away. There will be a minor league system for the NFL among 20-30 schools in the next 5-10 years. Players wont be student athletes at that point. However, I like the idea of a student athlete and commend Pitt for making players attend class, get meaningful degrees, stay out of trouble and graduate. There is honour in this approach.

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  22. Roc – agree and disagree. We arent clean. There were 5 classes we took yhat were a joke. I got A’s and maybe took 3-5 total tests. All schools have joke classes taught by friends of the Program. I was told what to take. Whole class was athletes.

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    1. In summer school, when I saw my class included athletes from football and basketball, I said Hallelujah Jesus. If you want to improve your GPA, take summer classes at Pitt that also have athletes. The easiest A’s I ever got.

      You right…Pitt definitely isnt clean. But its not as dirty as the rest. Elite athletes in elite programs take their own special classes with special tutoring and live in different dorms than regular students and eat in athlete only mess halls. They arent part of the student body.

      I would have loved to take basket weaving 101 at Penn State. JoePa’s players took that one and then majored in some BS major like Football history. Answers to all tests were provided before exams. If people think this stuff doesnt happen, I have an igloo to sell you in Texas.

      The NCAA is a joke.

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    1. Yes. what will happen when Heinz becomes a dump and the cost to maintain is too high? Architects and engineers have told me that stadium was built to last only 25 years. So my thinking is that the Steelers will not re-invest in Heinz and will not do major renovations to keep up with the Jones’s. They will hold the City hostage and will most likely move to the suburbs to realize tax breaks to build a new retractable domed stadium with the latest technology. Its inevitable much like the Eagles winning the Super Bowl today.

      And Pitt being Pitt without a plan will follow the Steelers. Have fun students being bused 35 miles to a game.

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      1. Tx_ Heinz was just voted on of the top stadiums of all kinds in North America, higher than PNC. The Steelers won’t move from the North Shore in your lifetime.

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        1. I’m going off what the architects and engineers tell me. Heinz will have outlived its life in 10 years. It will become a maintenance nightmare like old Pitt Stadium. It will be too expensive to renovate particularly with the newest technology and creature comforts to view games. Why upgrade when you can build a new stadium tax free? And one with a retractable dome (Steelers host a Super Bowl with one). The Steelers will be moving. It doesnt take Nostradamus to see this thing through. Pitt then hitches a ride with the Steelers because Pitt is ignorant and run by buffoons.

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        2. Pitt’s attendance problem isn’t the stadium -it’s the fans. Look at UConn football and basketball – they are struggling but still draw.

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  23. ROC3 … GPA of 2.0 is the minimum at Pitt .. how low can we go ( reminds me of an old song)

    Best chance for local stars this year all martriculated to Notre Dame…

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  24. Not today Bernie!

    Philadelphia’s defense is just too good Brady is getting too old and honest to God the patriots not that good this year.

    Phillies balanced and they will wear them out with the running game

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      1. Yes but NFL cannot risk losing fans and people are sick of Pats. Plus my Buddies Brother, and Fayette County Boy Gene Steratore and another guy from PA are reffing.

        Liked by 1 person

  25. Last year I though HCPN closed on some top talent at the very end of the recruiting period with Sibley and the other Fla RB, but I think the early signing period is working against Pitt this year.

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  26. Watching the Waste Management golf tournament… more fans in the stands on the # 16 par 3 than we get at some of our home games… a little exaggeration but not much….

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  27. Hey if 0-11 St. John’s can beat #4 Duke, I guess the E-Girls could win their first Super Bowl.

    But then again they have some guy named Fools playing QB.

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  28. PITT’s new recruit Erick Hallett said this about Narduzzi after his verbal.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    ““He seems like a really down to earth guy who really cares about his players. He cares about the team as a whole and not just about football but academically and socially and how we’re doing in life. To me, he seems a lot more like a mentor than just a football coach,”
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    …but that’s just a PITT recruit and a kid talking, what do you expect him to say?

    Like

    1. He was also qualted as saying, he was shocked he got the Pitt offer as he narrowed it to UTEP ( Yes El Paso) UNT in Denton and the powerhouse Prairie View. So when he thought he could get a scholarship to a P5 he jumped on it. Better get some Barbacue if we want him to stay past his Redshirt Year.

      Like

  29. Unfortunately with Pitt is quantity over quality. Maybe the experience gained last year will help Hamlin and Coleman as much as his first year helped D. Jackson.

    Like

  30. You can offer a kid in 7th grade, 8th grade and so on. The offer is “Unofficial” because the kid cannot bind. The whole point is to make the kid feel special and that you want them. You get in the door. C’mon now.

    “For the fifth time in the last year, the Pitt football staff has offered a high school freshman.

    QB Caleb Williams, DT Desmond Watson, CB Omar Simpson, Athlete Derrick Davis and now a player from Maryland.

    Today, 2021 defensive end Monkell Goodwine From National Christian Academy in Fort Washington, Maryland is the latest freshman phenom to hear from the Panthers”.

    This isn’t rocket science. Look at the “early” offers Pitt has made in the last two weeks. It gets them in the door guys and we haven’t done that lately. And to be clear, recruiting is like rebounding to me. It is a ll about effort…..and personality.

    Like

  31. Amen

    Chris Dokish@ChrisDokish
    There is a segment of Pitt fans that truly are a miserable bunch. They’d complain if Pitt lost in a national championship game.

    BTW, the new commit had previously committed to Wash St

    Like

    1. I suspect this was part of his almost day long Twitter agenda about the future of the basketball program and people were repudiating his BS. He’s on a mission for EJ, Lyke and Stallings.

      At the moment Dokish is sure that Carr, Stevenson, Stewart, Luther, Wilson-Frame and Ellison are legit high major players. So far 4 of those 6 players are part of a high major program that is losing in historic fashion. Ellison is also well acquainted with losing. At least Luther was once part of a program that had a winning record.

      I sensed the tweet wasn’t about the FB recruit, but perhaps it was.

      Like

    2. Dokish is an apologist and Pitt homer. Dokish is one that sees butterflys come out Narduzzis arse when farting and sees Stallings riding a unicorn with fluffy kittens in each hand. His ‘love’ of Pitt blinds him to the mediocrity and incompetence which is real. I dont think we fans will be seeing any national championships anytime soon so I’ll complain about how Pitt continues to screw things up and will refuse to live in some fantasy world denying reality.

      Like

  32. I would add one more thing. Many years ago Tim Lewis was injured early in his nfl career and became a terrific defensive coordinator.

    Perhaps Pitt goes outside the box and starts having a conversation with Ryan Shazier about opportunities if he is interested. It would bring credibility to the program and he appears to be a high class fella which is a great selling point to parents. Just a thought.

    And although I think we should recruit in the top 25-35 each year depending on size of class, the reality is that our Administration is inept and we can’t sell a game day experience.

    Finally, the OL who said he eliminated Pitt when Peterson split was using that as an easy out. Kids struggle to tell coaches they want to go a different direction and latch on to any excuse to make it easier.

    Like

  33. Except for one class ranked 21. Wanny classes were from 28 to 47 on ranking on rivals. Not exactly killing it. Wanny didn’t win the NE in 6 years with superior recruiting vs BE programs. QB recruiting will be the difference under Narduzzi.

    Like

    1. Interesting about the stache. He is seen as gold standard of where pitt can recruit and his classes werent rated that much higher. He also had much more talent in the wpial to draw from, freedom to run his program the way he wanted, and was a pitt man so no pitt steppingstone negative recruiting like narduzzi gets. Plus it was nuch easier recruiting against paturdo than franklin. Makes u wonder how high we should expect recruiting rankings to be now.

      Like

  34. Good call Upitt

    “Plus my Buddies Brother, and Fayette County Boy Gene Steratore and another guy from PA are reffing.”

    Had i known Gino S & Perry Paganelli were doing the game……….

    All they needed were Dino & Carl to round it out.

    Like

    1. Yes congrats to the Eagles. But will due respect the Eagles defense played as poorly against the Pats as the Steelers have in the past.

      Like

  35. I just read the bball thread from the UNC game because I can’t blog and focus on the game at the same time. Hats off to at least seven people who almost made me pee my pants with laughter. Emel, UPittbaseball, and Wbb, your comments and sense of humor help make these dark times for Panther nation more livable…Bill Hillgrove, the voice of Southern Utah.

    Like

  36. A few things:

    Pitt’s academic standards for athletes mirrors the NCAA minimum. Way back in the day we held higher standards but that went by the wayside years ago.

    The early signing day reply helps the big schools like the Top 25 and also lesser schools who are really good at recruiting. It kills schools like Pitt who sit around and hope a good recruit will be holding out too long and then find his options narrow considerably…then are scrambling around to get a P5 scholarship

    Where DW was so effective in recruiting was that he had great ability to look past the surface with 3* and 2* and find ones who will become stars in college. I have said many times that because of where
    Pitt is located and the high competition for recruits from PSU, OSU, WVU, etc, our program needs to have big true star players to win games.

    No other Pitt coach from the mid-1980s on has been able to field star players like he has. So, yeah, his classes weren’t highly ranked – he got a lot of 2* recruits, but they had star players like McCoy, Lewis, Ray Graham, Baldwin, Jacobson, Sheard, Mustakas, Byham , Malecki , Otah, just to name a few stand-out impact players.

    We won games on the strength of stars.

    Narduzzi’s first two years had Conner, Boyd, Price, Bisnowaty, Johnson, Holtz, Orndoff, Whitehouse, Henderson, O’Neill ..again starting lineups with true “stars” throughout. All inherited players and almost all those names above played very well in the first three years at Pitt.

    I look at the roster right now and of the kids Narduzzi has recruited, and have been eligible and got into games, I’m hard pressed to point to any of them and say “He’s a star football player”.

    Like

  37. To follow on: Possible stars on current roster… Who have already played in games

    Pickett, Weaver, Dane Jackson,… maybe Hamlin? But that is about it from the current roster.

    Some kids will break out, they always do, and we’ll have some solid starters, but again Pitt needs true star player to win games and I fear we arent getting them through the first three full years of Narduzzi’s recruiting classes.

    Like

  38. Sibley and Davis had twice the star power as Conner coming out of high school. I guess I’m saying, give the kids a chance.

    Reeves > Orndoff

    Like

  39. It would be interesting to know if anyone ever did a study to determine the percentages of the elements that make for successful BB and FB programs. The elements could be recruiting, coaching, location, practices, academics. funding, etc. By the way, which state has the most Super Bowl wins?

    Like

  40. As I said Ike, some will break out but I truly don’t see the star power on this roster that I’ve seen in years past and I think that will be a problem going forward.

    Saying Reeves is better than Orndoff is a hell of a reach Ike. When Reeves has 35 catches for 579 yards, 16.5 ypc and 5 TDs in one season then well talk.

    Orndoff’s career stats: 58 catches for 897 yards with a 15.5 ypc for 13 TDs. When Reeves can do all that and can block downfield like Orndoff could then I’ll agree, but I doubt Reeves will do that.

    Orndoff was one of the best TEs Pitt has ever had. Hell, in Dickerson’s All-American year he had 49 catches for 529 for 10.8 ypc and 10 TDs. Orndoff bettered him by almost 5 ypc.

    Like

    1. Let’s never forget Orndoff dropped a TD that would have tied the bowl game late. Pitt players have a habit of coming up small at big moments sadly. It has been going on for some time now.

      Like

  41. couple things Reed, I was typing my comment when you posted your second comment so I didn’t see it. << sometimes I get up and do things in the middle of typing. I guess that’s the ADD in me?

    Also, I’m speaking more about the reputation coming out of high school. Hard to catch a pass when your being red-shirt.

    Like

  42. Hopefully Ford is a star. But I agree that I don’t see those guys that will make it big at the next level. However, did anyone think Donald would be a superstar before his senior year? There are guys that just get better every year and hopefully we have some. We need guys like Hendrix, Camp, Watts, and a couple of the young O-line to have break-out years.

    Like

  43. Jackie Sherrill once told how he melded with TD to recruit him. HE PRACTICALLY LIVED ON HIS FRONT PORCH. Jackie was a Mississippi boy and found out Tony’s mom loved pecan pie so Jackie had his mom bake a special pecan pie for Mrs. Dorsett and arranged special shipping. That’s recruiting!

    Like

  44. Now though is the time Narduzzi should be confident in his rsFR & rsSO recruits to really get out there and shine and instead he’s populating the roster with transfers… And to be honest his transfers, save Peterman, have not done all that well here at Pitt.

    Fans bragged about his recruiting over the last three years and we aren’t seeing the results everyone expected so far.

    Again, except for the OL position and maybe QB every other position is able to have FR and SO kids play early on, especially if they redshirted.

    In his first full class he had five 4* recruits, two are gone in Hill and Pugh, and Hamlin and Watts have been average. Flowers played last year and didn’t have any catches.

    What also concerns me is that of all his LB recruits fans love so much only Brightwell has gotten any starting time. None could replace either Zeise or Idowu – two players (a walk-on and a position switch) who aren’t so good they couldn’t have been sat down… And it looks like those two will start again this season because no LB recruits are better.

    Plus Narduzzi has even said publicly that if Wirginis is healthy he’ll be the starting MLB, which means after three full years of PN’s recruiting we will most probably still see three Chryst players as starters at LB. Especially as Narduzzi tends to play experience.

    Is that because he values experience or because those older players are still better than the younger kids. Fans slobbered over Narduzzi’s 3* recruits yet this happens?

    Problems in recruiting are still happening I believe…

    Like

  45. We all learned about natural selection as yutes. I mean “you the za” your honor. Reed is spot on and supports my thoughts for the last few years, especially the podcast where we found Roy to be a starter on the DL. I think my quote was “this is the biggest surprise to me because our recruiting isn’t producing enough quality talent to unseat someone who wasn’t even recruited to play that position”. Either Roy is lights out and everybody missed on his talent for years, or we just aren’t recruiting well enough.

    I may have mentioned the LB’s as well with a walk-on. I am sure AI mentioned the walk-on with the center as well. It is not uncommon to have a walk-on earn ONE spot on your team, but when you have three, and at critical positions, it becomes a problem. We have Aston, Morrissey and Idowu. We have Herndon, Roy and Zeise that played and were recruited at other positions.

    We have been getting some quality recruits at RB according to the stars,. However, if they run behind a bunch of no stars in the trenches, their talent will not cover up the blocking shortcomings. Either the dudes can block or they have to go. If I am running the squad I put three guys in charge of recruiting all 4 and 5 star linemen, period! Offensive and Defensive. Trenches win games! Recruit better trench players and you will have a better team.

    Like

  46. I think maybe not enough analysis goes into why 4 and 5 stars fail rather than 3 stars who make it big. There are many reasons why 5 stars can fail such as academics, injuries, disciplinary problems, etc. Just take the QB position. A top program will take a top QB or RB every year by telling them they will be a star. We all know there is only one QB starter per year, and the clock starts ticking on their careers when they arrive. Browne is a good example of a 5 star who might have been good if he red shirted a year and then played 4 years at the same school. Linemen take years to develop, and there are many examples of 3 stars who played only a year or two in high school, and then stayed for 5 years at a college starting the last two and then going to the NFL.

    So position by position, some positions may actually develop better by getting 3 stars who are there in part for academics and will stay 5 years and work on their skills. That said, it is obviously better to get higher ranked recruits every year, but there are many reasons why there is not a precise correlation between star ranking and success on the field.

    Liked by 1 person

  47. Yeah Voice, I get that. My point is that young guys should either be pushing the older guys to the bench or to transfer out because the young guys are better, or, the competition drives the older player to get better. Either way, one of those has to occur for the team to get better. If it doesn’t occur (and it hasn’t been), expect nothing better at any position and recruiting becomes just a “push”.

    I think that is why many believe recruiting is bad at this point. At a net 3.0 ranking, it’s not terrible. You get what you pay for. Star power is lacking and I worry we will stop getting 4 star RB’s when they run behind walk-ons and RSJr’s that aren’t proven blockers!

    Fire the BoT and Administration!

    Dilly dilly.

    Like

  48. I’m with you, Huff. Good coaches can see the potential that younger players have and must balance this against the constant pressure to win now. I was just suggesting that for some positions and some years, all 3 stars might not be such a disaster. But QBs, RBs and WRs are a different area, and if recruiting doesn’t pick up in these skill positions quickly, we will be looking for a new coach soon. PN must be under incredible pressure to win now, coming after the 5 win no bowl year. It is no wonder that the recruiting class is weak. I guess there was no bounce at all from the Miami win.

    Like

  49. Reed, Huff and VoR, please relax. Trust in Pat’s plan. He knows what is best. He has selected these fine young men and knows what is required for them to succeed. He and his trusted staff will help them to find the way.

    The 5 win season was primarily the result of an extremely young team having played an incredibly difficult schedule including several ranked opponents. In fact some have suggested that the 2016 and 2015 football schedules may have been the most challenging in Pitt’s storied history. Coach Pat has led us to tremendous victories before and will most certainly do so again!

    Better things will happen this year. For example I have it on good authority that several players having no prior D1 experience and that few have seen play before will have very big years. Trust the process.

    If all of that isn’t enough to ease your troubled minds I suggest spending an hour or two each day on Pittsburgh Sports Now or following Chris Dokish on Twitter. There is no more effective palliative treatment for a fan of Pitt sports than the insights of these credible, sensible, reasoned, informed and undeniably objective sources. I suggest frequently posting some of what you may read there right here on the POV to help others who may also seem troubled. You may find that you no longer feel the need to develop and express your own ideas and opinions and we all will find peace.

    BTW, much of this also applies to the men’s basketball team that is coached by Kevin Stallings. Trust these Pitt coaches. Patience is a virtue and will be rewarded!

    Like

  50. VOR I pretty much agree about the needed stars for the skilled positions of RB, QB and WR. However Conner at 2 stars and Pickett(stardom pending hopefully) at 3 stars says differently. Let’s hope we have quite a few differently’s in this class.

    Like

  51. jrnpitt, these exceptions are what we live for. It gives us some hope when the recruiting class on paper looks bleak. Remember also that Conner was a convert from a different position that perhaps few people could have seen coming. On a different subject, has anyone heard an update on Danya Kingsby? Is he still on his JC team, and is he still being offered? Also, did anyone report who the FB players were that got in some kind of trouble after the Miami game? Are they still on the team?

    Like

  52. No no no Barvo, PITT is most certainly doomed! There is no way PITT can compete in the ACC while only getting 3* players with lousy no name offers. How does anyone expect PITT to get any better when the hire a life long coordinator as head coach? They would have been better off digging up Knute Rockne and why didn’t PITT go after Nick Saban who surely must be getting sick and tired of winning all the time at Bama.

    … and BTW, most of PITT’s 3* recruits are actually just 2* nobodies, anybody can see that. It’s plain to see that Narduzzi doesn’t have it, after-all he hasn’t even won a bowl game or won 9 games in a season. I say PITT gets rid of the current coaches staff and start from scratch once again. It couldn’t get any worse could it? Hell no.

    I think it may be time for PITT to drop down to D-4, but nope PITT will never do that, they just keep losing and I can’t stand it for one more second. I’m just going to keep on complaining every single day saying the same things over and over and stomping my feet until I get my way. Where’s my teddy bear… ike

    Like

  53. One day before LOI Day and this is who we get to come from out of state, Missouri, to campus on an official visit…

    5* kid? No.

    4* recruit…well, no also.

    How about a 3* with great offers? Uh huh, no.

    Unranked QB Derek Green as a preferred walk-on.

    https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/2018/derek-green-180498

    This would be hard to believe if it wasn’t so funny and typically Pitt. Remember, on an official visit Pitt picks up the tab for the full two days…airfare, hotels, meals, etc…

    And since no one decent even wants to look at us on this late date we are actively rolling out the red carpet for this guy whose only other offer was Dayton. But wait!!

    There is still some drama with young Mr. Green:

    “I had a scholarship offer from Dayton, but I told them I was hoping to go bigger. They understood where I was coming from, and I’ve been telling them about Pitt; I told them that whether it was scholarship or a preferred walk-on, I was leaning to Pitt. It was just awesome there.”

    Green plans to check out SMU in the next few weeks; he’s got a preferred walk-on offer from the Mustangs as well, and after he makes that visit, he’ll pick Pitt or SMU.”

    So, we still could get left at the alter…

    Combine this with the kid we got yesterday and these are the recruits we got when fans were thinking we were going to be landing studs after the early signing period.

    Like

  54. I think the internet combined with their egos has had a big impact on how 4-star players look at recruiting…

    I’d like to see some of you guys get a 4-Star to pick Pitt after he’s been to a Pitt game with the stadium half- full. Oh, and that’s a week after the 4-Star goes to a game at PSU, and before taking in a game at Notre Dame, or even VT…

    Hell, I feel bad for the kids who did come to Pitt when they run out of that tunnel to such a disappointing welcome…

    Until you fix that problem, the high-star kid coming to Pitt will be rare…

    Go Pitt.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. I do it inmy business all the time. I sell I do the little things and I’m relentless all while it is hard to get top talent on our side of the tracks. It takes work and selling. Pat isn’t likable and parents see his Napoleon syndrome.

      Like

    2. Majors, this isn’t a new thing only Narduzzi has had to deal with…everyPitt HC has had to deal with it. DW had No problems getting 4* and some 5* recruits here…PC did well on that front also.

      Imo that is excuse making for a HC who isn’t doing it.

      Liked by 1 person

    1. Ike – Just admit you are also let down by the talent Narduzzi is recruiting. Everyone sees it. Just like you finally got off the Rockport Train.

      Your opinion will carry way more weight if you admit how bad it is. Love you buddy. Heading to Florida cold in Cincy.

      Like

  55. ike, can I borrow your Teddy Bear? I’m feeling a need to retreat to the fetal position and crawl under the covers with a snuggle bear. Let’s face it, there are no easy answers. Pitt will need to grind out recruiting classes a step at a time until they are first winning 8-9 games a year, and then move up from there. They will need to get lucky at times and take some chances with marginal kids, transfers, etc. to get there. Attendance will hopefully slowly climb as they start inning more games and getting to bowls again.

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  56. Ike, one main point I made above is the fan’s bitch about lack of support from the Admin…then Narduzzi goes out and spend thousands of dollars on a walk-on’s official visit.

    C’mon, you don’t think that’s pathetic? We can’t get any out of state blue chip kids to take official visits so we throw money away on an out of state unranked walk-on… who may not come here anyway.

    Here that sound?…that’s Narduzzi scraping the bottom of the barrel.

    No agenda Ike, just showing you all what is happening on the Southside.

    Like

  57. Who can ask Coach why aren’t there any 4 stars. What’s the plan to get them? Do reporters fear being denied press access for asking these softball questions?

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    1. Basically yes.

      Last year Chris Peak wrote a good article soon after LOI day and in it he quoted coach Narduzzi as being “disappointed with the ones that got away” after they have been recruited heavily by Pitt. And that is with three 4 stars in the class and being 38th ranked.

      Imagine what he’s thinking this year with this no blue-chip class and being 44th ranked.

      I look at this recruiting from all angles and really everything should be positive and going in the right direction with it but the opposite is happening. That makes the info I got last month regarding the problems in the internal administration of the recruiting program even more believable.

      This last gasp of trying to convince an unranked QB to join as a preferrred walk-on (which means he gets a scholarship as soon as one opens up) just reiterates my real worries about our QB position. If Pickett falters, and he could do that -nothing is guaranteed – or gets hurt we have zero D1 experience on the roster…none.

      This is an personnel area Narduzzi has done horribly in. His two recruited QBs weren’t good and both took off already , so we are left with a true SO to run the offense with no real quality behind him.

      As much as we needed Peterman and he was great for us, getting Browne and starting him makes any decent QB prospect wary of Narduzzi’s promises at their recruitment. He basically screwed MacVitte by not letting him take even one snap at all, then drove DiNucci away by bringing in Town, who he obviously brought in to be the QB2.

      We need to turn this around for the class of 2019 or we’ll have years of bad two-deeps.

      Liked by 1 person

  58. When is Stalling’s next Arse Kicking? 4-27 soon and tbey keep him on th payroll. How is that even possible. Come on Heather. Next home game may have 34 people. Especially if Pappy van Winkle brings his kinfolk.

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  59. As I recall, Shady went to a packed BB game when Pitt was competing in the Big East, and it had something to do with his commitment to Pitt. Narduzzi probably avoids the Petersen Events Center these days… Reed is right, it is a waste of money to recruit these walk ons. But the bigger question is why can’t PN get any 4 stars to visit? If you can’t even get them to come on campus there is no possibility of recruiting them.

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  60. I hate this litsburgh garbage. Any marketing without results is bush league. Kids like it yes but do something before claiming litsburgh. You were 5-7 last year. Act like you have been there before. Stupidness

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  61. We really need this kid. He’s a good RB and the staff feels he could play right away… Mike Farrell of Rivals said this just today and predicts him to us.

    “RB Mychale Salahuddin – Pitt – The Panthers are thin at running back and he could make an immediate impact there and he knows that.”

    This would be a very good way for PN to finish this class.

    Like

  62. Last year PITT’s starting center and fullback were walk-ons but you already knew that. When did bringing in a player that doesn’t use up a scholarship become under such scrutiny?

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    1. He’s going to get a scholarship… he’s a “Preferred Walk-on” which means when one comes open.

      Again, my point is the $$$ we spent on his official visit…and not getting blue chips on campus.

      Like

  63. I understand the concept but he’s not getting a scholli against this years numbers. I didn’t hear or read a thing about Morrissey last year.

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    1. Last year’s recruiting class didn’t suck hind tit like this year’s does.

      You are fixated on the player… I’m talking about recruiting.

      I’ve nothing against walk-ons at all, but when fans were desperate for a big finish to this class…we get a preferred walk on from Missouri who is unranked and who no one ever heard of…plus we sprung the $$ for his official visit.

      The only thing worse is if he picks SMU over us which just may happen.

      Like

  64. Okay, thanks ike. I’m still not clear on the status of JC BB player Kanya Kingsby. Does anyone know if he is still being offered?

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  65. Pitt this year doesn’t have the room to recruit 25 recruits. Plus the early signing period changed the dynamic for the second recruiting period. Pitt presently is at 85 and adding probably 2 more recruits. adding the RB and DE add enough points for 20 players which is the max Rivals uses as the rating for a class. A quick calculation places Pitt in the mid 30’s if both commit. Never mind Hallet had one of the best SS at the Nike Camp in the country and his vertical is 37″. Plus his offers were impressive academically. Never mid the fact the DB everyone wanted will go to Louisville and used Pitt as leverage to get his deal. Wonder why Kentucky never offered a KY 4 star at the time? But I assure you his “handlers left the Louisville athletic offices with smiles and bulging pockets. Narduzzi got wind of this sh** and dumped him like a hot potato. Yet this 5-9.DB was a must get. Pitt has a very good class. . .

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  66. Reed at this point I couldn’t care less of who the player is. To me it just seems like you’re digging deep to find a fault when with this walk-on there is none. Not sure of how much money was spent but if he does come on board it was money well spent. $1500 is not going to break the bank. PITT needs arms going into next summer camp.

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  67. maybe some perspective here. I know we all want 4-stars … you want them, I want them. However, to infer that this class sucks with all 3-stars, while last year’s class didn’t suck because of three 4-stars (2 of them didn’t play this season) may be a bit too much.

    Also note that two of those 4-stars last year were born and raised within a 40 minute drive from Pitt … while this year, there were only two 4-stars, in total that were within ore than an hour’s drive.

    Like

  68. Brian Batko@BrianBatko

    Seven NFL combine invites for Pitt, tied with NC State and Virginia Tech for third most in the ACC (behind FSU and Miami). The full list:
    * Quadree Henderson
    * Jaryd Jones-Smith
    * Avonte Maddox
    * Brian O’Neill
    * Jester Weah
    * Jordan Whitehead
    * Ryan Winslow

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  69. Not hard to debunk any O’Neill’s involvement, which he was not a part of. He wasn’t involved and has a pristine record while at PITT. No stone un-turned when it comes to background info on potential draftees.

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  70. @Barvo – I am not in the camp of canning Narduzzi. In fact, I am the only one that suggests that if our recruiting class is ranked 60 or under, he is overperforming based on the salary he is being paid. Same with his W-L record. 6-6 seems to be about what his pay equates too. My personal expectations are a top 25-35 recruiting year ranking (depending on class size) and 7-5 minimum (depending on schedule. W-L’s will
    fluctuate if we can find an AD that learns how to schedule.

    My main point remains. I am fine with 3 stars if they begin pushing out the two stars and underperforming 3 stars that are older. That is how you improve. Competition does that.

    @Reed – the budget may call for walk-on entertainment versus 4 star entertainment. It’s not just the cost of bringing a kid in. It’s the cost of the follow-ups and a quick cost benefit analysis. My sense is that it is cheap budgeting.

    Kids use the term “lit”, which is actually from the word legitimate. It’s quirky and stupid, but the kids use it. Crew 412 seems more appropriate. Speaking of marketing gone bad, is there a reason that our teams still read Pittsburgh on the espn scroll? Why aren’t we changing it to Pitt?? no identity with this program….ohhh, maybe it’s a good thing until we get better.

    All the best to Pittman and Mrs. Pittman. ^5.

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  71. Reed, I dont feel narduzzi has shown yet that he is a good recruiter.
    However, isn’t it possible that the recruitment of those two kids you mentioned, is part of building a foundation for future recruitment in Texas?

    You have to start somewhere and it is really late in the game to pull 4 and 5 stars out of Texas this close to signing day.
    If they spent the money in order to lay the groundwork for future Texas recruits,by going to high schools down there, meeting with head coaches, and getting a couple of kids to come to Pitt to give them something to tell their friends back home about, I am okay with that kind of investment.
    It has to start somewhere and i suspect most kids down there havnt even seen a Pitt shirt in a long time. Texas is populated with a ton of talent and it’s worth trying to get the Pitt name down there somehow.

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  72. Of course we should can Narduzzi … this is Pitt. The guy with the best FB record in 30 years gets sent packing. The best BB coach the school ever had is shown the door after reaching the NCAA for the 11th time in his 13 seasons. Narduzzi is 21-17 … oh we can do so much better! Yea right! No doubt we will make a great hire this time

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  73. I say we keep both Narduzzi and Stallings. The negativity for Stallings on this site is over the top. Give the guy a chance, please. The test of his coaching ability will be if he keeps this group together and they continue to develop into good players. Please remember that over the past 30 years Pitt has been lousy at hiring coaches, with no long term stability to build the inroads into the recruiting hotbeds. So be careful what you wish for.

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    1. Pitt’s administrators must be idiots to listen to these jagoff fans who complain and want football coaches fired. Gottfried never should have been fired along with Wannstedt. Firing both made Pitt look incompetent, which the administrators are in fact. Now I’m reading if Narduzzi doesn’t have a breakout season he’s toast. If Pitt goes 7-5 should he be toast? I say heck no.

      Depth is building nicely on the roster.

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  74. I never said Narduzzi should be fired. Four years then go/no go.

    The walk-on is from Missouri not Texas.

    Narduzzi chased the hell out of far away players.. He just couldn’t convince them to come to Pitt on either official visits or to play ball here. Take a look at the offer spreadsheet again.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1MsK4CPR5dSGo20EmY-N_9CB_ObRd2ivGiUqf1Zv1kZw/edit#gid=932498085

    Then look at the 2018 visit list…one 4* visited; only one out of 105 4* and 5* Star offers.

    The bottom line here is that the fan’s have waited since early Dec for Narduzzi to c!ose out this class with a bang and its pretty evident its hardly a whimper.

    Getting the 4* RB will help this class but overall if you say you ain’t disappointed in this class…his third full year…then either you have Pitt blinders on or you are lying.

    We all expected better.

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    1. Listen to Chris Peak’s latest podcast. He thinks Duzz and company are doing great on the recruiting trail.

      Totally opposite of the POV take –

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  75. Pretty sure that everyone wants to win and there is no fright there. Stalling has not been given a chance but if Heather can find a way to part ways it may be for the better. The hole has gotten too deep to climb out of. After only two years it would be better to start over now.

    As far as the football program, I hear so many times how the PITT football program has been lousy for 30 plus years. Yeah because they keep firing successful coaches. Firing Narduzzi will be back to square zero. I realize this is a blog for PITT banter and discussion but constant volatile comments without ever an encouraging word is getting old.

    Lastly. Narduzzi is not going anywhere unless he wants to, not the other way around. Quite frankly, I don’t know what you people expect out of the guy. Huff is right about the pay but PITT is getting a bargain basement paid coach that has already proven he can win at PITT and in the ACC. ike

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    1. What has he won in the acc??? Proven? He never competed for a ACC Title yet. How is that proven??

      Stallings never given a chance. He has full autonomy and is 4-26 in ACC. God Bless America.

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  76. My last message was in response to Upitt and Reed, I know you are on record as not wanting Narduzzi fired. I think this PITT recruiting class is good with no apologies given

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  77. ike – Here, I’ve been thinking the purpose of this blog was to crush any sense of hope a Pitt fan might try to have… 😊

    Go Pitt.

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  78. Wait, I forgot, if I have any hope and excitement about anything Pitt, then I’m accepting and enabling mediocrity…

    Go Pitt.

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  79. This was never going to be a large class and possibly 20 is on the high side. Pitt and Narduzzi did the lions share of recruiting and like many programs got the majority of commits the early signing period. So look for 4 to 5 recruits LOI day which brings them to 20 at most. Keep in mind, the transfer WR from Indiana is also here and will sit out this year. Some may have expected better but in reality this is a good class that has some very good recruits.

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    1. Chet, I think there are only two possible recruits tomorrow the 3* DE & the 4* RB. I pretty much doubt we’ll see four or five. If they sign five more that brings up to 23 which means PN will have to get rid of five existing kids on roster.

      Which might not be a bad thing.

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  80. Upitt: Narduzzi beat the ACC and the National Champion’s last year and the ACC Coastal Champions this year. That’s proof enough for me he can win in the ACC. What’s illogical about that football math? Your ill-will towards PITT is illogical though.

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    1. And lost to Syracuse and VT and GT and UNC and NC ST. Yes he wins some big games but loses bad ones. He isn’t consistent enough to declare him proven.

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      1. He lost with FR and SO’s.

        They gained valuable playing experience – 2018 better be a breakout year or Duzz is toast.

        I’m a believer that the breakout will happen.

        This team is loaded with the most depth in the past six years.

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  81. With respect to Stallings, he has to go. He has been here 2 years. The program has regressed.

    Compare the two and we have a clear cut winner and a clear cut non-winner. The non-winner needs to exit immediately, stage right. There is no sign of improvement for the basketball team. Losing by 20 points at the end of year two is enough evidence for me. You just can’t do that.

    The good news for basketball is that the fortunes of a program can turn with one big recruit.

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    1. it wouldn’t bother me either way. I guess I really want him to go because he shouldn’t have been hired in the first place. On the other hand, I hate to see that s-bag et $10M for doing nothing

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    1. Can he win consistently? Or lose to bottom feeders and beat an occasional great team? Until he plays in a ACC championship or even wins his own division he is an avg coach.

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  82. Never, ever draft a RB high in the draft. They are a dime a dozen. Barkley will flame out like all other Pedo RBs that were drafted high.

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  83. On Stallings, I suspect (and UPitt will love this) that the decision on whether he goes at the end of this season depends more on the accountants and attorneys on Pitt’s staff than on Heather L.

    If the CPAs can find a way to make the money work – and not have the buyout hamstring Pitt’s future options – I think Stallings clearly will be gone soon.

    If Stallings had a couple of impact-type recruits coming in, I think he’d get another year, but that’s not the case.

    Go Pitt.

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