in Pitt Football 60 Words

Which bowl will Pitt go to?

Pitt’s bowl selection gets announced today. Predictions have ranged any where from Belk to Pinstripe to Motor City versus a variety of opponents. Here’s the latest chatter. None of these should be considered reliable…yet.

400 thoughts on “Which bowl will Pitt go to?”

  3. as I wrote in the previous thread, I expect Pinstripe, Military or Quick Lane because they are the shortest trips from the Burgh. POVers notwithstanding, Pitt fanbase is not known for its traveling

    Liked by 1 person

  5. ^^ Great piece, thanks JoeL. You probably started a days worth of comments of people explaining how well and where the PITT football program would be right now. I’ll start, PITT would be playing in the playoffs by now at the very least if some boneheaded AD didn’t hold a grudge against Wanny. 🙂

    I thought Dave seemed a little rough on the kids until I remembered back to my days in midget football. Coach Hutch use to scream his head off 35 times a practice. One kid came to practice with his hair sticking out of the back of his helmet, coach grab a hold of the locks and asked. “Two up or three down” He took 2 up and he got them, funny part was his dad was an asst coach and just watched.

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  7. I am considering foregoing the bowl game and focusing on the NFL draft. This has been a draining season of pitt football for my fanhood.

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  9. Does it really matter.

    Another meaningless bowl game against a crappy opponent in a crappy location. Pitt deserves the toilet bowl.

    Now again if the music city bowl I’m there because you can’t beat Nashville. But a mediocre Pitt with mediocre support will get a mediocre bowl that will be attended by no one and given a horrible TV slot.

    Will give narduzzi a chance to go zero for four in bowl games.

    Liked by 1 person

  10. We need a win, it doesn’t matter vs who or where. Although for the kids and fans somewhere warm and dry would be nice, not likely though.

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  11. What opponent will improve our stature? We would probably lose to Navy, MSU, UCF and any SEC school.

    Best we avoid Detroit. ACC will surely send us to a nice cold small bowl. Maybe with a MAC school. Not optimistic.

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    1. Heathers Job is to campaign for the best possible bowl. I’d cash in on some favors. Threaten to expose the ACC commissioner with some pictures. Bribe officials. Do whatever it takes to land the music city bowl.

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  12. I am hoping we play an awful team so we can just get a win. But even if we do play a bad team we will probably play down to the competition and make it closer than it should be or lose.

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  13. No matter how you look at it the ACC Bowl slate is really weak Very good thing the ACC has Clemson to represent in the Bowl Championship otherwise no hype for the conference at all.

    Another reason it is difficult to recruit to Pitt. Look at the opportunities for bowls in the B1G, where would you rather go if you were a player?

    They say having ND has given us better bowl access, really? How much worse could it be?

    The real question is, can Narduzzi finally get his players motivated enough to win a bowl game? I there enough time and interest to get Whipple to put together a game plan the kids can execute?

    Will we end the season as a fumbling and mistake prone, penalty prone, dropped passes often team of what if? and another bleak off season, or can we finally get our s%&t together and give us some hope for next year?

    I’d say the stakes are pretty high for a low level lackluster bowl game if only to Pitt Fans.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. This gentleman is reputed to be pretty accurate.

      The quick lane would at least be a winnable game.

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    2. The second worst bowl on the lineup. Pitt will get the honor to lose to a MAC team in a bowl attended by fewer than 10,000 people and 500 Pitt fans. Four star recruits will love it.

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        1. I know you say that in jest but Narduzzi better win the bowl game because if not it’s another 3 game losing skid and the heat will be turned up next season with little margin for error on his part.

          They squandered the Miami and BC games this year, next season if they don’t win 9 he has to go because the program seems stuck at 7/8 wins as high points.

          Liked by 1 person

  16. Narduzzi can go 6-6 next year or maybe even 5-7 and his seat will still be cool. It’s just the reality of it. BUT he better NOT!

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    1. I’d be shocked with 6-6 or worse next season, but our cupcake OOC schedule looks not as easy as we had hoped. Miami (Oh) went from being a MAC doormat to winning the title game yesterday and only loses five starters. Marshall returns a lot in 2020.

      Give me Detroit versus WMU. We need a win in the worst way to end the season.

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  17. Bring on theMAC… we frigg’n pummeled Ohio… we crushed Delaware… Duzz is undefeated against the type of foe…..

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  19. ACC will make sure we will always go to Detroit, Military, Sun or Pinstripe even if we win 10 games. South bowls for original ACC southern teams only,.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Wow that’s a slap in the face, the ACC announcers screw us, the ACC refs screw us and we get a crap bowl courtesy of the ACC.

      Liked by 1 person

  24. Eastern Michigan… I saw them at fits Stadium along time ago and they came back to beat us… I think Charlie batch was their quarterback

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    1. That was in 1995 and Pitt scored 66 points and won. That horrible Pitt program from the 1990s scored 66 points in a game and won its first 23 versus that conference before its first loss to Toledo in 2003.

      That was how bad the MAC used to be. The trickledown affect from D-1 parsing down from 105 to 85 scholarships that season was still a few years away.

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  34. Pitt is historically bad in bowl, they had a mediocre record, and have no wins against power five teams with a winning record. Why should we play anywhere else???

    Liked by 1 person

    1. I believe the ad’s have a say in what bowl we get. Blame her or blame the team for allowing us to go to the bowl.

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  38. If not for the $$ the ACC shares with its member schools, Pitt deserves to be in the MAC where they are more competitive. Western Michigan is not a shoe-in win for Pitt. A loss to WM would be a big setback for Narduzzi’s recruiting. I think like 1962, Pitt should have declined the bowl. And stayed home and let the kids rest for spring practice.

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    2. More competitive? Deserves to be in the MAC?

      Didn’t Pitt win the coastal division last season?

      They were 4/4 this season not 0/8.

      I disagree

      Liked by 1 person

    1. Haven’t you read the comments pittman2003. There is no way for PITT to win this bowl game no matter what the score ends up being. PITT could win 55-0 and the complaining will continue and PITT will be the loser. Cry me a river…………. boo hoo..

      Liked by 1 person

  41. if Pitt played the same crap OOC that the rest of the conference plays, it has 8 wins … and a better bowl. But still no excuse for last week’s game.

    BTW, Andy Lee is still punting with AZ Cardinals … and has punts of 60 and 53 yards so far

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    1. WWB,

      Please point out to me this season how our OOC would make the difference?

      I guess Pitt would replace PSU, to get 8 wins but they can’t/won’t.

      The only way they get the season ticket renewals is by having an anchor team, whether its PSU, Notre Dame or WVU.

      One of those teams will always be on the schedule.

      Also, even replacing PSU with the Citadel ain’t gonna change anyone’s mind about where this team shou6 play.

      Perhaps being more competitive in conference would be a better tact for Pitt.

      I get your frustration. I share it. A good start would be winning a bowl game against a MAC opponent.

      Dave

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  43. From what I see.
    6-6 ACC teams
    NC – Military; BC – Birmingham; FSU – Sun; Miami – Shreveport.
    7-5 Louisville – Nashville

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Did we really want to go to any of the destinations that the 6-6 teams went to?

      Maybe the military vs temple but I’m not so sure Pitt beats Temple this year…at least with they way they’ve been playing lately

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  45. from a PG tweet:

    Pitt (7-5) was selected after three 6-6 teams and ahead of only Boston College of all ACC eligible teams.

    Like it or not … this is not on the coaches, this is not on the AD … this is on Pitt fans

    Liked by 4 people

    3. And heather extended meatballs. Heather alienates season ticket holders. Heather has no marketing plan. Heather has no influence. Don’t blame fans.

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  47. Until the team plays better, they won’t get a better bowl. Until the team gets a better bowl (bc they played better) Pitt fans won’t attend the bowl games. So it starts with the team to give us a product we want to watch and spend $$ on. I don’t want to travel to a bowl to watch us lose winnable games. Just sayin’.

    Liked by 6 people

  48. Some positives: As MM noted, it’s inside a climate controlled dome. It’s played on a Thursday evening at 8 pm, not a crappy noon game. There are no other bowls playing at the same time. 4 1/2 hour drive from the Burgh. Might mean more Pitt fans than say a flight to El Paso. Eastern Michigan University is 38 minutes from Detroit; maybe they will bring a decent crowd.

    If it’s any consolation, read the Penn State message board. They play a coach-less Memphis. Similar can’t win scenario. I believe their game begins at 11 AM. They play at the same time as Notre Dame’s bowl game. Fair to say, they are not happy.

    Liked by 4 people

    2. James Conner had his big bowl game in Detroit to – The Pizza Bowl as our friend Emil called it.

      Look for a RB to have a breakout game – one of two Carter’s is my pick. And I’ll call this The Quicky Bowl – I did lyke De-toilet Bowl though…

      Liked by 1 person

    4. I have it a like mostly because of the second paragraph. Although you also make to cogent points in the first

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  51. Strong ADs do in fact have a lot of say so in bowl selection. A seasoned AD with excellent, established Bowl Contact Relationships, leverage that relationship to get a better bowl.

    Liked by 1 person

  53. Well, one comment. There are some(most) awful bowl matchups. I mean, really poor games. These are the worst match ups I’ve seen in a long time. Mostly who cares games. Usually there are a few games I like to see, this year, at least initially, I’m left cold.

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    1. I bet we have a 14-21 pt lead at half but find way(s) to let the Eagles back in before springing a PITT special redux… catching the Birds “ flat footed.”

      Liked by 1 person

      1. I agree BigB, this is a total impressment, If the loose need to get Bill Cherpek from TJHS that just don’t a state championship to coach next year

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  55. Pitt fans would travel to a warm location. To see a quality opponent. You just can’t blame fans for not being interested in crap bowls in crap cities against crap teams. 💩

    The committees make the decisions but the AD and commissioner have influence. Pitt obviously has an AD that is neutered and the ACC commish does northern schools no favors.

    But Narduzzi deserves this fate. Fans however do not. Heather better buy herself a yellow parka for Detroit. To any fans who plan to attend, god bless you.

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      2. Pitt fans will travel to meaningful games

        when Walt gave Pitt a bowl for the first time in a long time. Pitt got a strong contingent for a New Years Eve bowl in Memphis. I was there.

        When Pitt went to the Fiesta to represent the Big East, great showing. I was there

        Dont blame the fans

        Pitt fans are the most loyal fans on the face of this earth given the crap thrown in our faces by our own administration, Nitters, Hoopies, Domers and every conference commish.

        Our numbers may be small but Pitt isnt a state school with branch campus dummies and operating a diploma factory. Pitt is relatively small and pretty much private these days. The ‘large’ alumni base has been alienated and abused by previous administrations. Its not the fans fault so lets just get that straight because dem are fighting words you loosely use and shows your ignorance.

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        1. TX, I found the Post-Gazette estimated 11,000 Pitt fans were at the Fiesta Bowl.

          From:
          https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/pitt-football/2005/01/02/Fiesta-Bowl-Notebook-Ute-s-Meyer-chosen-top-college-coach/stories/200501020194

          You would have thought the Fiesta Bowl was being played in Salt Lake City. The capacity crowd of 73,519 seemingly was split something like this — 61,000 Utah fans, 11,000 Pitt fans.

          From:
          http://utahfootballcountdown.blogspot.com/2007/08/1-2005-fiesta-bowl-utah-vs-pittsburgh.html

          Besides a convincing performance on the field, they also did well in the stands. A vast majority of the sellout crowd of 73,519 at Sun Devil Stadium wore red in support of the BCS busters. Utah is the first team from a conference without an automatic bid to participate in one of the system’s financially lucrative bowl games — the expected payout is between $14-17 million.

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          1. 11k was a good showing for Pitt. Most if not all Utah fans drove down. Pitt had a very respectable showing. I was there so I should know and dont need articles to remind me.

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          2. I was there too. A sea of Utes – it was impressive. If we had that team, a lot more Pitt fans would have showed up.

            I asked a couple Utes who was guarding all the banks back in Utah while the whole state was in AZ – “The Mormons!” Was yelled back in unison.

            Had the pleasure of spending some time with Coach Majors there at “The World’s Largest Tailgate Party” outside SunDevil Stadium.

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  56. Which bowl we play in does not matter to me unless it was the Belk or a better bowl. Pitt losing the last two games got us to where we are. We get more practices to develop our underclassmen. Wishing for a two quarterback system in the bowl game but know better.

    Still bummed out over Pitt volleyball’s loss last night. What a terrible way for this senior class to go out. Cincinnati played extremely well and we had some difficulties. Cincinnati had one superstar that we could not contain and her supporting cast played extremely well. Hopefully the men’s basketball team will continue to grow as the season goes forward. The women’s basketball team is trending into the toilet at the moment with a loss today to mighty Stony Brook Seawolves.

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  57. The blame for Pitt playing in a crap bowl extends to everyone: administration, coaching, players and yes terrible fan support. All are responsible for this mess. No need for finger pointing as everyone has played a part in this mess

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    1. Pittman, I just can’t see how you blame the fans?? The prod had been so average for such a long time. What is the draw for us?

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      1. The fan support in general is terrible. I get the product has been suspect but the crowds have been awful at heinz field. The crowd of maybe 30 k after beating Clemson in 2016 is an example. The fans are part of the problem.

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        1. the fans are rebelling like me. why pay top dollar for a crappy product in a crappy stadium off campus

          now you have the acc network to watch on your 70 inch TV and comfy couch with better eats and drinks in the fridg

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          1. Tex you are a “One Man Wolfpack” in your rebellion.
            And you don’t pay top dollar to go to pitt games. The tix are dirt cheap. From what I understand they were literally giving away free tickets to BC and we still had about 10k show up.

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            1. I know. That is pathetic that Pitt cant even give away free tickets. That would get 99% of coaches and AD’s fired. But not at Pitt of course where mediocrity and embarrassment is not only tolerated but warmly embraced.

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  58. Pitt plays heathers former school. So after over three years at the helm, Heather has managed to arrange playing her former Mac school. That’s what heathers influence buys you Pitt fans.

    And do recall, this football program at EMU is only still in the Mac because heather refused to make program cuts to balance the budget. So when the new AD took over, he had to cut 4 Olympic sports which were very successful.

    EMU has a revenue issue much like Pitt. EMU balanced their budget without heather. Heather continues to run up 10 million dollar deficits at Pitt. Pitt is still revenue challenged and spending money on football like drunken sailors. All to play eastern Michigan.

    I plan on burning a yellow blouse tonite.

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      1. I’m dead serious about that burning. I plan on buying a cheap yellow blouse at Walmart. Then writing in black marker the following: ‘Heather Lyke – the DESTROYER of Pitt football’

        I will pour some lighter fluid on the blouse, light a match, throw it and watch the thing go up in flames. Once the blouse is hot ash, I’ll pee on it. Then I’ll crack open a cold beer and yell out H2P! I’ll chug the whole can in seconds and then let out a big BELCH.

        You dont want to know what I plan to do with Meatballs.

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        1. last year and then the year before that and the year before that
          not this year out of protest
          I’ll fly in next year to pay homage to the POV tailgate but I wont pay for tickets and wont accept any tickets unless they are truly free
          Pitt football will get none of my money until Meatballs is gone
          I’m thoroughly disgusted with the direction of the program and refuse to become an enabler of mediocrity

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  60. Well I won’t be going to that game. I’ll watch and hope we win, but I spent 6 months in Detroit many years ago and that was enough for me.

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  61. Sad to say but they should play the Little Sisters of the Poor if necessary to get a bowl win. An 8th win and a bowl win will prevent the disaster of a second straight 3 loss finish.

    Liked by 4 people

  62. Like I mentioned earlier. Lots of posters already saying PITT can’t win this game no matter what the final score ends up being. It’s SOP FANS! You want a bowl win or not?

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  63. Anne and everyone else, over the past 5 years, Pitt has won more ACC games than any team but Clemson and Miami. They win just about as much as anyone else in the ACC.

    The problem is the community just doesn’t care about Pitt FB, and even many Pitt alums that I know can care less about Pitt, Remember, even when Pitt was the winningest team in the country (76 to 82), the only games it sold out in a 53k stadium were PSU, WVU and ND.

    And for that matter, although they probably had the best team ever in 1980, they had to settle for a non New Years game even though they finished 2nd in the polls

    Liked by 3 people

    2. ask yourself why dont more Pitt fans care. Why arent more fans like me?
      Pitt has a small but very loyal core of supporters
      I would stack their loyalty up against any school including the Aggies down here
      If you knew the answers and the solutions like I do, you could be an instrument of change
      The casual fans are apathetic for many reasons
      I dont consider anyone who reads or posts on here to be casual so how do you transfer your mindset to 300,000 other living alumni and thousands more non-alum fans?
      You give them something to rally behind
      MPC

      Liked by 1 person

        1. How? Any AD with a brain would have been discussing a feasibility study for a MPC within the first year on the job and not this Victory Heights project which is not going well from a fundraising standpoint because its not BIG enough and because football is left out. My way of thinking is obviously too progressive for your mind hence the insult.

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  64. So VA wins Coastal goes to Orange Bowl. Losses very badly to Clem.
    Pitt wins Coastal goes to Sun Bowl. Losses badly to Clem.
    Just saying.

    Liked by 3 people

  65. Ike, that’s exactly what it is. A power 5 school who is a 10 pt favorite should beat a MAC team, every time. If you aspire to be good, you have to win. If you do the expected, then that’s it. If you lose, well, that’s a sorry state of affairs. If the only bowl wins you can get are vs MAC teams, well, seriously, what’s the big whoop? You should aspire to be better than you are. Unfortunately, they played themselves into this game. Don’t blame Heather, the situation is what it is. Nice to win a bowl game, but a win over EMU won’t do much for next year. A loss, however, would be a big setback.
    That’s my story and ..I’m sticking with it.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. The Steelers dont treat their fans like the dirty standing water at the urinals in the ‘O’s’ basement.

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  67. I agree JoeK, a loss would be terrible. You get my point, a win just means more complaining, not a win either way.

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  68. As much as I complain about the ACC scheduling, reffing, bowl slate etc., the truth is we are very fortunate to be in the ACC and live with the dregs they toss our way. It still gives us a nice check and an opportunity to earn our way to the top. Even though we have third best overall record since we joined, lots of room to prove ourselves and improve our position.

    I can live with Detroit, but not a loss, it is time to earn some respect and this would be a good time to start.

    Bowl games have always been subject to their masters and Pitt is hurt by poor attendance no matter the reason. The big bowls pick schools as much for their attendance as they do for their records. It is probably more important to sell seats than have a good game.

    By the way the Steeler Fans taking over Arizona was impressive, that is how you show support.

    Liked by 3 people

  69. Another ACC hatchet job on us at 7-5 and we get the like the worst ACC bowl game. Of course only have NoDoz and Toilet Paper to blame, with the joke performances against BC, Miami & VT.

    From the Orange Bowl to the Toilet Bowl. Somehow so typical…so Pitt.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. But Pitt likes this torture and I’m afraid too many fans have grown accustomed to it and have become comfortably numb

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  70. ^^ For more reasons than one gc. Great points of destinations for away games for one along with winnable games but remember, divisions and leagues run cyclically.

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  73. Biggest concern at this point is the effect of the season ending losses and unimpressive bowl selection on recruiting. Narduzzi is apparently out recruiting this weekend, and keeping the current class together should be a top priority.

    Liked by 1 person

  75. Just got back from a long weekend but read all the posts this morning.. Agreed that we got exactly what we deserved. Not screwed at all by the ACC or the football gods. We die at the end of every year, can’t win a bowl game and fans don’t travel. What bowl would want us? I’m sure the Quicklane folks wish they had anybody else and I’m sure EMU is jumping for joy.

    Liked by 1 person

  76. We shouldn’t be wringing our hands over Pitt’s deserved Bowl fate. After those last 2 performances I can only hope that the team and coaches bust their a$$es and finally come up with a performance that we can be proud of. Most exasperating season I can remember.

    Liked by 1 person

  77. We Pitt fans always go to the “we were screwed” response. Wronged by everyone around us. Fact of the matter is we get what we deserve and I think the view of Pitt by the outside world is correct.

    I am fully anticipating we will lose the bowl game. Coaching and players won’t rise to the occasion. I hope I’m wrong by the way!

    So if we lose, did we really deserve more? All of our teams “Pitt the bed”. Take a look at volleyball. Tremendous season – really proud of what they accomplished. Rise to #2 in the ranking. Us fans scream that we got the shaft for not being a top seed and then we go on to lose in the second round at home. So once again, maybe the outside pundits were right. And maybe they are right about a lower tier bowl. Did we do anything to demonstrate we deserve more? Not with the way we closed out the season.

    Liked by 1 person

  79. I wrote this on a previous page…a MAC team is just what the Dr. ordered. We win easily, get an 8th win, have a nice feeling to end the season on. No need to lose to a Big Ten team or possibly get beat by Temple.

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      1. There can’t be anyway we lose to EMU. You are correct that if we lose the sky is falling and I would not have any good will left for Mr. Nard.

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  80. My first impression is we got what we deserved in terms of a bowl, not just because of an underachieving, mediocre 7-5 season/record, but because of two other factors: (1) the way the team finished the season by playing really bad football, and (2) due to our putrid offense; who wants to watch an offense like that in a bowl game?

    There were rumors recently about pressure on Lyke for Narduzzi’s results, I have no idea how true those rumors were or not, but I’d certainly hope the pressure would be unrelenting if we lose to E. Michigan. Don’t get me wrong, I’d prefer to see Narduzzi succeed and will be routing for him, but ultimately a lofty salary should bring with it high expectations.

    Liked by 1 person

  81. The last time in Detroit 2013, Pitt won its last bowl game and FR RB James Connor had his breakout game (229 yards), and would become ACC Offensive POY in 2014.

    Could history repeat and this be Vincent Davis’ breakout? No. knowing our OC, the only frosh with a breakout chance is Jared Wayne, and that is unlikely

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  82. The way this season is going down leads to the dreaded apathy…I know I have it…a break from PITT FB is in order…”the whole bowl thing has gotten out of hand” ” I would rather not watch this one.”(that’s my apathy talking)

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  83. It may be small consolation, but PSU fans are all torqued about not getting the Rose Bowl and also being passed over for Michigan playing Alabama in the Citrus Bowl. And, we know PSU fans travel.

    So, while I am disappointed with the way our season ended, I am still happy overall with the record. Remember what some of us were predicting back in September.

    I will be cheering on our guys (from my comfy couch, since there is no way I am going to Detroit over Christmas) and looking forward to next year’s team.

    pmdH2P

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  84. It isn’t after a loss…more like after an embarrassment but I’ll weigh in anyway.

    Is this honestly what Pitt fans expected after a full five seasons of Narduzzi’s coaching and four full recruiting classes? A season where we are 4-5 against Power 5 teams and go to literally the crappiest bowl the ACC can send us to?

    Sorry, but this is exactly what trusting The Process has given us. A rusted out engine under a MAACO $200 paint job. Some on here will jump up and down and point to us beating Eastern Michigan (if we can) and getting 8 wins again as some sort of progress after the last two seasons. That will be done much like last season’s excitement after winning the Coastal and finishing with 7 wins.

    The real gauge of Pitt’s current status is what outsiders think of Pitt football and this bowl selection is a true indication of that. It’s pretty much a way to say “Nobody really cares about Pitt any longer”

    I was really hoping for the Military Bowl so I could visit with some of you again even if we would get our asses kicked by Navy… Now its just another blah bowl that we better win.

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    1. IF we can win our blow game and finish 8-5, I would say that’s about where most of us expected the team this year, but it’s also a disappointment (even with another win). Again, I think Narduzzi has done a respectable job and stabilized a program that was reeling at the time of his hiring, and as pointed out elsewhere, I think he’s finally got together some good depth at many positions, especially on the defensive side of the ball. But failure to take us to that next step should bring an end to his tenure here in my opinion. My question would be, when? Should that next move be made now, or in a year or two with similar 7-8 wins seasons?

      Liked by 1 person

      2. Exactly the whole truth and nothing but the truth 1618. Let’s revisit the preseason prediction thread and look at what ever thought PITT and Narduzzi would do this year. The goal posts are constantly being move by PITT fans.

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  85. I agree with Reed. Those last too losses, especially the BC loss was just plain bad for the program. This team should be playing for a ninth win at a minimum.

    Narduzzi is getting what he deserve with this bowl.

    I don’t see this guy ever getting past 8 wins. Next year this team will be older and should reach 9 or 10 but I have zero faith that happens. They will reach seven and have a late season collapse as usual.

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  86. Military Bowl is a good one…my Carolina posse is traveling there..I highly recommended the experience that JeanieB and myself had “A+” got to meet the Commander JoeL, JoeKnew and Pat Bostick…I would go and watch Carolina play Temple but JeanieB is 100% PITT while I rot with apathy…
    I say Duzz is gone after next year…too many teams on the rise in the Coastal…

    Liked by 1 person

  87. Narduzzi and staff showed they can develop players from a physical standpoint. This team was never physically over matched. There was not one game this year that I watched and thought we had less athletic talent. Not like previous years. Credit to Dave Andrews.

    The problem is the players did not develop mentally. Maybe part of that is changing OCs so often but that is still on PN.

    The biggest problem, Narduzzi has not developed as a head coach.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. Duzz hasn’t recruited well on the offensive side of the ball band it showed this year…we didn’t blow any team out-not one ! We are weak in so many positions on the O…..we shall see what transpires during this off-season/recruiting commits/transfer portal…..1st 2 seasons of Duzz could have been 9 season wins but we blew the bowl games and that loss in the Miiitary Bowl was a real dampener to our Mo as we has beaten PSUX and Clemson..this season gave us a chance at 9-10 wins but we blew it again…being out-scored by our opponents during the season should show you how much the O needs to improve, heck, we could have lost 3 or 4 more games.

      what are the odds Paris Ford leaves ?? I say he goes even if he is projected in the 4th round- getting there is his goal ASAP and he will prove himself more worthy through his effort on the field to secure the big money….

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      1. The O is a year behind the D in development. You can also say the coaching is weaker on offense.

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      2. The NFL grades you as either a 1st or 2nd round pick. There is no specific round that Ford will be told he will drafted in past the first two. If he doesn’t get those first two grades and he declares he is gambling big time.

        Ford needs another year of lifting and improving his tackling.

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  88. I just don’t think the Pitt admin is going to fire PN as long as he’s winning more than losing and keeping a clean program with no real negative press.

    If so, why hire an AD like Lyke that had no real track record of anything but compliance? I truly don’t think most Pitt fans believe the impact that DW’s last two years, the multiple and many arrests of players and the SI article had on the BoT which wants a pristine image of the university at any cost.

    Thus, Pitt has gotten just what they asked for. Sure they want big winning seasons but not at any cost. The fact that this coaching staff has, by far, the biggest salary and recruiting budgets of any previous staffs (way more than just inflation increases) sends that message.

    But Pitt wants, above all else, a positive image of the program and the school to the public.

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    1. Time and again, 7-5 seasons gets the coach fired at Pitt. Reed, Why do you think all of a sudden this will change with Narduzzi? He will get fired if 7-5 next year, another “guru” coordinator will be brought in, they will get 5 years and be fired after another 7-5 season. Wash, rinse, repeat

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      2. Yep, the new guy is the supposed savior until by year three we see he is the same as the old boss: no balls, his teams lack discipline, he cannot recruit QBs and on and one it goes.

        Pitt for once needs to go against the grain and keep a guy who goes 7-5 to see if it leads to breakout season by year 10. What’s the harm.

        Liked by 1 person

    2. Yeah, count me in as one who doesn’t believe of the DW impact. “Many” arrests?

      We’re still blowing this out of proportion 10 years later?

      The BoT has its sacred pristine image right now, which is damn near impossible to have in college athletics. Fans want wins, the BoT is worried about an image that nobody in the 49 other states cares about (Yeah, Pitt is and afterthought, athletically and academically, across the country).

      Winning this bowl game is important and finishing with eight wins would be an accomplishment with this inept offense. You don’t keep Canada you run the risk of missing out on the next coordinator and Narduzzi has done so with his last two hires. Whipple is going to cost Narduzzi his job after next season.

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  89. Here we are another Ho Hum 500 or just above 500 season and a crap bowl. Guess the realists were right again.

    This team couldn’t even win the MAC if they played in it (My opinion and I am entitled to it).

    Then to add insult to injury Parris Ford is looking to explore the NFL (Good for him), but why in the h e double L did he ride the pine the last two years.

    On a positive note the last bowl game we won was a Pizza Pizza victory in Detroit if I recall (LOL).

    Liked by 2 people

  90. We all know the ACC FB pet this year was VA. Who will it be next year? VT, NC, certainly not us.
    We have a chance in BB with Capel but I doubt it.

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  91. While I agree with Reed that we all hoped that Narduzzi would have us in the top twenty by now, and that may have been an achievable goal, it wasn’t met. How realistic is that goal and how close did we come?

    I think most would agree our defense exceeded our expectations this year, certainly after Weaver and Camp went down before the season. I’m afraid our D won’t be as good next year without Johnson and Ford, two guys that won’t be easily replaced. In any case we will still have play makers on D.

    So it gets down to our offense. Even though most of us did not have high expectations for the offense, starting with the line and questions about the QB, all new backs and problems at tight end, the offense remained the question mark all year and really faded down the stretch.

    Furthermore the strength of the team Ffrench and Mack, were hampered by injury, when needed most.

    The most disappointing was the lack of a running game, with carries being shared by four guys no one excelled.

    With a new and complex play book execution was a problem all year. The team was plagued by motion penalties, dropped passes, fumbles and interceptions and a putrid red zone production.

    QB play was pretty much as expected, with some nice winning drives, but too much inconsistency down the stretch.

    So for next year will we be better and by how much? Many questions remain. The line should be better with some experience, but by how much? Will we get a serviceable tight end? With Ffrench and Mack gone, will Wayne and Shocky be good enough and make big plays? Will the running game improve and by how much?

    Special teams loses its star in Ffrench, we saw what happened when he missed the last four games, no returns, it really hurt field position in those two losses.

    We saw much better depth that helped the defense, although the loss of Ford for the targeting cause noticeable weakness.

    Hopefully, our depth is maturing for the offense, especially on the line. The big question remains, will we have enough play makers on offense?

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  92. I think Reed is right on as far as Pitt Administrations expectations and satisfaction with a clean program and making a bowl game. If they really cared about winning 9 or 10 games they would lighten up the OOC and make it much more achievable. Playing WV and Tenn in the same year makes it almost impossible, especially if we get a tough crossover game.

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    1. thats true but are we as fans fine with being labeled mediocre. the rest of the nation thinks that Pitt is just a middling football program and doesnt care about sports (see directors cup). the public’s perception is mainly shaped by performance on the field. look how quickly baylor and penn state bounced back from scandal. people crave winning.

      shouldnt the administration aim higher. talk is cheap about that front porch.

      this over emphasis on running a sparkling clean program is killing the program. might as well drop down to division 3 then. I think the Pitt BoT has a germ phobia.

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  93. This year, UVa is going to the Orange Bowl and Medenhall is being praised.

    A year ago, UVa was 6 and 2 and ranked 23rd when a 4-4 Pitt team came to town and soundly beat the Cavs. UVa went on to lose 2 of its last 3 games (only win vs Liberty College) to finish season 7-5.

    I keep telling you people that stuff like this happens everywhere except to the elites when it happens less often. But remember …. in places like Miami, Tallahassee, Austin, Knoxville and Los Angeles (both schools) where TALENT ABOUNDS, it is even worse.

    I am as frustrated and angry as any of you with how Pitt finished, but anyone who thinks stuff like this is solely a Pitt phenomenon is sorely mistaken

    Liked by 3 people

    1. what is uniquely Pitt is that Pitt tolerates and fully embraces mediocrity while these other schools quickly make changes if performance on the field falls short of expectations. These other schools have higher expectations and dont mind playing between the lines unlike Pitt which has a very low bar and an obsession about running a program more pure than a virgin.

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  94. Both WV & Tenn are very beatable but I agree the scheduling has been a disservice to the program for a number of years now.

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  95. I don’t think PITT would have lost to Navy this year. That Navy team in the Military Bowl a few years ago was really good. PITT can play well against triple option teams these days and with this defense they could have kept the scoring low enough for the PITT offense to win the game. << moot point. PITT would have been a bad match-up for Navy imo.

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    1. i didnt think Pitt would lose to BC. Narduzzi would find a way to lose to this year’s Navy just like Pitt will lose to EMU in Detroit.

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  96. I didn’t think the players would fumble the ball 3 times against BC either Tx, or inexplicably make stoopid penalties that would constantly set the team in reverse.

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  97. Under the heading of what have you done for me lately … Detroit is to be expected, and that is somewhat of a gift. The last two games were just an embarrassment … and PN needs to own that.

    When I quit watching at half time, and take the Pitt flag in for the year… sad just sad.

    I live in Cincinnati, so I am seeing a rated Bearcat team (#17)… did I mention embarrassment?

    I can’t see where PN is “earning his spot”

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  98. So there area total of 39 bowl games if I add them up correctly.

    CBS/Yahoo sports ranked the bowls from 1-39. Pitt is playing in the 35th ranked bowl out of the entire 39. Pitt is the lowest ranked P5 program as far as this particular bowl ranking. That said, everyone has their own opinion on bowls and rankings. However, these are published and used against Pitt in recruiting and overall reputation.

    I’m glad that the side story is our AD going against her old school! Whoopie pooh! That ain’t a story. The story is that Pitt is seen through the national media as irrelevant in the world of academia and sport. A solid AD fixes that and finds it unacceptable. This is so fixable and this goes to confidence. If our AD had P5 experience and was confident, she would put her job on the line and say this to Gallagher (before he starts to smash a watermelon), “Hey, we need to spend for the best. My professional reputation as an AD is on the line here and I am being humiliated by my P5 brethren for the total lack of support from the Administration to run these programs correctly”. If you give me $$$, I will give you blank (wins, rankings, revenue, etc.) in return. If I don’t produce, fire me!

    That sets expectations and commitment levels. If she doesn’t get the commitment to get to a certain level, I lose respect for her if she stays. If she gets the support and doesn’t achieve, I lose respect for her as an administrator and she leaves. She produces, she stays….and gets raises and I celebrate with her. Firing a bunch of people doesn’t make you a good or great AD! Firing people just means…you fired people!

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    1. I don’t trust a compliance person with money. I don’t trust her strategy for building a winning culture, making the proper investments and leading panther nation to the next level. Heather is Pitts Lucy.

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    2. Huff, I hope against hope that Heather is finding the right football coach to lead Pitt and will not fire Duzz until she has him. Looking for the Capel version of a football coach.

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    1. Sure looking like Ford could test NFL waters. Morrissey and Twyman may benefit from coming back, but I can never blame a guy for leaving if they think they will get drafted and make money. Mack may not get drafted if he declared, so are you suggesting another transfer for him?

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    2. I would be surprised if Ford came back

      Mack will return

      Twyman…I’ll say 50/50

      Morrissey probably stays. Not sure why I think that but I do

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      1. I will be surprised if Ford leaves. Lots of questions surrounds his learning curve right now. It’s why he jumped from three or four high schools and he didn’t play much his first two years at PITT. He also need to pack on more muscle and weight. BTW, looked like he hurt his shoulder against BC and did not finish the game, missed most of the fourth quarter in fact.

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    3. parisisland..depends on their priority…if it is to complete their education or continue to grow as a player then then the player will chose to stay…if you have a ton of talent, possibly come from a lower socio-economic environment and getting to the next level has always been the goal in playing college FB(or BB), you declare if the NFL thinks you will be drafted in the 1st 4 rounds…..wonder if Paris Ford and Twyman will participate in the game against the Mighty Eagles…? Just my thoughts….Oh, wasn’t it great back in the day to know our team players would be there for us for the full 4 years

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  101. ^^ To Altoona Josh……. If PITT can somehow win this upcoming bowl game and finish at 8-5, then the self referred to posters as realist, which they are not, would be dead wrong. realist = negative imo.

    btw, I have never made any attempt to quell any POV commenters in anyway shape or form.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Ike
      Realist does not mean negative. Realists like me properly predicted 7-8 wins and no Coastal and Virginia winning it and getting blown out by clemson. I don’t use a crystal ball or own a tardis. I look at facts and evidence and use my head and not my heart.

      A realist points out Pitts failures. Not my problem that pitt has few success stories. But I point out volleyball, men’s soccer and wrestling as programs to emulate. All three programs have very good coaches and heather doesn’t get in their way.

      But football is different because heather extended the dirty dog with meatballs for brains. She owes her job in part to him. She gives Narduzzi too long of a leash. He should be in her dog house yet he still sleeps on her bed.

      This is just another mediocre season. A special season would have been 10 wins, a nice bowl and a final 15 ranking. That should become the norm but won’t under this AD.

      Liked by 2 people

      1. Well maybe you stayed at a Holiday Inn Express the night before your prediction Tx. 🙂 Also, there is a big difference between 7 and 8 wins when you are only playing 13 games.

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  102. Ike, answer the question that I posted above… Is this where you think Pitt should be as a program after 5 full seasons and 4+ recruiting classes under Narduzzi? And you have been singing his praises since his hire.

    I believe almost every Pitt fan would answer that question as a “no”.

    You are correct that some predicted a lower win total; that doesn’t mean those fans don’t want much better results and a stronger program. What PN has done so far is win 8 games – one more than PC, in a single season, two less than DW and one less than WH – the last three HC’s with any tenure at Pitt over one season.

    Of course he also gave us our lowest win total in a decade also.

    He has worked out just about as I expected from a life-long coordinator. He does some things well; some poorly and gets average results almost every year. I say average because winning between 8 and 5 games, losing or not going to bowls games and not being ranked at the ends of five seasons is truly average at best.

    He gives us thrills every so often, but IMO he gives us disappointments more. He is what he is and we’ll keep getting what we have been as long as he’s our HC. I just don’t see any Top 15 or Top 20 seasons out of him.

    Liked by 4 people

    1. ,Reed, None of us want the 5-7 win seasons but it is the reality of the situation and I see it continuing into next year as well… we all want to be ranked, we want our team to be successful…Heck, PITT fans are the equivalent of NFL’s Bills, Lions and Brown’s fans…forever abused but faithful and so we remain..

      If the POV and some of the great minds here were in charge I could see us a ranked program still struggling to put 50,000 asses n seats but never-the l-ss ranked…I and many on here totally agree with you that this is on the administration and their business plan…

      Duzz has and our boys have blown several chances at 9 win seasons..some on coaching, some on the players…we betrter get something going on the O side sooner than later, if not, there will be a coaching change next year…Heather will be the survivor for better of for worse….

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  103. ^^ Reed, I haven’t been singing his praises since Narduzzi has been hired. I’ll admit to defending him though against all the constant criticism he’s received. Hardly singing his praises. Is this exactly where I want PITT to be? A coastal division title and possibly 3, 8 win seasons in 5 years, the third most ACC wins and a clean program. Pretty close. The Stanford and BC losses not withstanding. They SUCKED in those two games!

    Reed, you yourself pounded into our heads that the PITT administration is way more interested in running a football program that would not embarrass the University rather than win football games and I believe that to be true, 100% So this is what we get. What makes you think PITT will go out and get a better replacement under those circumstances? Yes I know you haven’t called for his firing so why complain when you know the playing field?

    PITT did screw the pooch with the BC loss and opened the door for the deserved critique of Narduzzi but I watched the game and the players let the staff down big time as well. No excuse for it, just the truth.

    Liked by 1 person

        1. I see his flaws scus7 and he’s far from perfect, just think he’s overly criticized because of his personality and people holding that against him, not his work on the sidelines. Which btw, has nothing to do with his coaching abilities. Next question.

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              1. I expect them to be bowl eligible just about every year. With narduzzi, I don’t expect them to win more than 8 games a year. That being said, a loss to emu is not a successful season but a win, gets us to 8 and well I suppose my expectations will be met and I have consider it a success.

                Liked by 3 people

  104. Pitt has had seven different head football coaches since beginning conference play in 1991. Pat Narduzzi’s conference win percentage, at .625, is the highest of those seven. Tied for second are Dave Wannstedt and Todd Graham, who each had a .571 win percentage in conference games.

    (Side note: Walt Harris had a .647 win percentage in his last five years at the helm.)

    Pitt won 7 or more reg. season games in 3 of 10 years before Narduzzi. Pitt has won 7 or more reg. season games in 4 of 5 years with Narduzzi.

    Let’s go further back. From 1983 through 2014, Pitt won 7 or more games 31% of the time (10 of 32 years). Pat Narduzzi has won 7 or more games 80% of the time.

    Thirty two years of history suggest Pat Narduzzi is performing up to par for his position.

    Now, if he doesn’t finish next season ranked in the AP Poll, I’d agree Pitt should move on, because at least one ranked season out of 6 should be expected. Everyone wants Pitt to reach the mythical “next level” I’ve been reading about since 2002, but for your own sanity don’t let it upset you when Narduzzi’s successor and the next several coaches after him continue the torrent of 5-8 win seasons.

    Liked by 5 people

      1. If you are anti-Narduzzi, that doesn’t help your cause. He has faced by far the most difficult non-conference schedule of any of his predecessors dating back to 1991.

        Liked by 1 person

  105. To add to my post above, here is the most astonishing stat of all: this is the 21st consecutive season where Pitt has won between 5 and 9 games in the reg. season. Pitt is the only one out of 65 P5 programs to have done this.

    In a very macro sense, we can look at the recent history of Pitt football as such: Walt Harris dug us out of the grave of the Hackett/Majors years and got us to a level of respectability. Neither he or any of the four men who have followed him have moved Pitt out of that level, for better or worse.

    Liked by 1 person

  106. I understand that the ACC Scheduling Committee is in a real quandry concerning 2020 league scheduling:

    All Coastal Division teams, plus Syracuse and our out-of-division opponent are DEMANDING to play Pitt in either Game 11 or Game 12 next year.

    Liked by 3 people

  107. Pitt in its final 2 reg. season games under Narduzzi:
    11/21/15 vs Louisville W 45-34
    11/27/15 vs Miami L 24-29
    11/19/16 vs Duke W 56-14
    11/26/16 vs Syracuse W 76-61
    11/18/17 at VT L 14-20
    11/24/17 vs Miami W 24-14
    11/17/18 at Wake W 34-13
    11/24/18 at Miami L 3-24
    11/23/19 at VT L 0-28
    11/30/19 vs BC L 19-26

    Under Narduzzi, Pitt is 5-5 in its final two games of the season. Average score: Pitt 29.5, Opponent 26.3

    Liked by 1 person

      1. My post was in response to the snide remark above which implied that Pitt always loses in their 11th and 12th games. Those aren’t bowl games.

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  108. To answer Reed, this is where I expected Pitt to be once heather was hired and knowing Narduzzi had a role in it. Knowing how Gallagher thinks and knowing the BoT composition. And knowing the general attitude of fans. I see no changes from this mediocre state because being mediocre is just fine to the administration and most fans as long as the program is clean and the mission statement is being upheld. It obviously is not fine with me and a small but vocal minority called realists.

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    1. You are right to expect and want more and I can’t fault ur criticism of the program. I actually have no idea of what pitt needs to do, so I’ll just hope like hell we beat emu

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      1. Pitt needs to stop treating us alumni and fans like dirt. That would be a good first step. Can you imagine the Steelers or Penguins treating their fans this way….poor on the field product, rising donations for season tickets, switching parking spaces, bad kickoff times, crappy bowls, lack of transparency, poor fan engagement, playing in a crap pro stadium

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    2. Except you aren’t realists or based in reality. The “realists” are characterized by pure hatred of Narduzzi with no ability to look at him or his performance objectively. I am not a “realist” but although i have been supportive of Narduzzi I can point out his flaws and say he has had a very bad year as a coach. I can be objective unlike the “realists.”

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      1. I personally dont hate anyone. I’ve provided my grades on him and Heather across various variables. He actually grades out better than Heather. Narduzzi I think is an above average coach if you look at his 5 years (this year was undisciplined). Heather is one of the lowest paid AD’s in all of P-5 and it shows. Narduzzi is ranked 40th in compensation but Pitt will finish this year ranked around 60 in Saragin and RPI. He under-performed. We all know that Heather finished ranked around 145 in Directors Cup…by far dead last in P-5. Operates a $10M budget deficit. Pitt’s attendance is on a steady decline. Donations are flat. More importantly, she lies (see those town halls, attendance figures) and is not transparent (financials, ticket sales). Huge character flaws.

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  109. Every Pitt fan wants the team to be more successful. Every fan of every team in the country wants their team to be more successful. What does that have to do with anything?

    Maybe we are right where we belong in the college football landscape. We are right there with 50 or so P5 teams who are not one of the 10 to 15 “elites”. We win and recruit with the Virginias, North Carolinas, Virginia Techs, etc. The structure of college football today favors a handful of elites and absent the proverbial “lightning in a bottle” for a given team, it is not likely to change. In my opinion, the caving of the NCAA to allow payments to players just adds to the advantage of those elite teams and the elites know it. Even historically elite teams like Texas, Florida State and Southern Cal have struggled to return to that status with coaching change after coaching change. What makes us think we should be able to do it when they can’t?

    I have had football season tickets since 1977 and will continue to buy them and attend every game until I can’t physically do it anymore. I do not want to sit through two or more seasons like I did at the Pete, hoping to be competitive against the worst teams and knowing you will be blown out by the better ones. And that can happen. Please don’t think it can’t. These seasons under Coach Narduzzi have been much better than that. A good defense is a step in a positive direction. I’m good with baby steps.

    Liked by 7 people

    2. I’m not good with continuing to be a baby. Pitt needs to grow up. Other schools with less resources have won ten games and don’t wait ten years to do it. Pitt spends real good money these days for some really mediocre results.

      I’m not asking pitt to become elite. I’m asking pitt to aim higher than mediocre and stop wasting their welfare check on bozos.

      And if you don’t believe in something then it will never happen. Many fans don’t believe and just accept fate. It’s not Pitts fate to Pitt or to suffer the curse of SOP or to be in mediocre hell. Pitt can change but refuses.

      You mention those former elite schools. All hit hard due to bad coaching hires. With being caught cheating. But all those schools are focused on winning championships. They don’t settle for participation trophies. We settle to just wake up with a pulse each day.

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      1. The only way for Pitt to ever win ten games is the Syracuse model – 3 non-conference cupcakes and a lot of luck (FSU being terrible and a bowl opponent whose QB leaves school early, etc.) Pitt does not and will not ever have the money to hire some dynamite coach, despite your wishful thinking and unfounded claims.

        Liked by 3 people

        1. Or to get a dynamite coach to come here, even if we had the money. Many Pitt fans feel that Kevin Stallings was a stupid hire and we got what we deserved. But the man was Coach of the Year in the MVC and twice Coach of the Year in the SEC. He took 9 teams to the NCAA tournament and 7 to the NIT. He was 55 years old when we hired him. He was a proven D1 head coach, not an assistant or newbie or half-retired geezer. He wasn’t the splash hire we all wanted. But he wasn’t chopped liver.

          Now his career is probably over. That is the risk of going to a middle of the road program trying to get to elite.

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          1. Farmers, good comments, I appreciate them, and I appreciate Tx’s opposing viewpoint too.

            But when it comes to basketball & Stallings, that was a gut-punch of a hire and everyone (except our administration) knew it. He was a bad coach, a pretty bad recruiter, a bad fit, and brought along a bad demeanor as well. Not only that, he was hired under very suspect circumstances to boot. Really, I cannot say enough bad things about that hire. Hey, I don’t blame Stallings, I’d’ve taken that money too even if I wasn’t about to be fired; he was laughing all the way to the bank. I blame Barnes and the people that allowed him to make that hire.

            So back to football, like I said, I will route for Pitt and route for Narduzzi, absolutely, but at this point I’d like to know what the plan is, and if the plan does not realistically include an upward trajectory (better yr2 for Whipple, new OC again, new QB, whatever…) which has evaded us up to this point, then we need a new coach imho.

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          1. Yes you habitually make things up. You constantly claim how much money Pitt spends and how big the budget is in your complaints about Pitt not winning 10 games, yet you’ve never shown how much Pitt actually spends or has the ability to spend, nor have you mentioned what any of their ACC competitors spend.

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            1. I have posted articles before and links to various publications. I wont do your research. Do google searches like myself. The answers are out there.

              Fact: Pitt has a top third spend on football (last figures I saw had it around $30M)
              Fact: Pitt has historically lost $10M on sports each and every year for as long as I can remember (40 years and counting). Their subsidy (by raiding the general fund) is among the highest in P-5…sitting at 15%
              Pitt refuses to discuss or disclose their books because it is a very dirty little ‘secret’

              My biggest complaints are that they are fiscally irresponsible and provide a very poor return on investment.

              A $90M spend on sports should get you far better than dead last in the Directors Cup.

              Running a budget deficit each year costs undergrads over $500 in extra tuition every year.

              But if you dont trust me, ask dear ole Heather. You wont get jack crap from her. At least I back up my facts with evidence.

              And if you want a second opinion, ask that A-hole on Pantherlair called Crazy Paco. He’s in academia and will tell you the same thing but he and I disagree on most things.

              Liked by 1 person

              1. Great points Tx but a question. So why are your expectations so high when you already know the pitfalls of PITT?

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                1. Because all it takes is the BoT to change their mindset and/or a big booster to open their wallet.

                  The Nitters have been purged from the BoT after 3 years of relentless pressure. Boosters cant be pleased with these crappy bowls.

                  Moreover I have faith that fans will apply their influence by failing to renew season tickets and foregoing donations much like I have. Money talks.

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        3. win 3 of 4 ooc
          go 6 of 8 in acc
          win your bowl

          theres 10 wins
          very doable with right ooc
          very doable with cuse as cross rival
          very doable in weakest P-5 division

          very doable with the right coach
          Pitt doesnt have the right coach

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      2. There are four teams in the SEC with 10 or more wins. There are four more in the Big10. Two in PAC 12, two in Big 12, and one in the ACC. I would put Minnesota and Baylor in the “lightning in a bottle” category. The remaining 50 something teams are in the same boat as Pitt.

        So you are saying that 50 P5 universities are content with being mediocre. Their Presidents and BOTs don’t care if they win, as long as they run clean programs. Their fans are perfectly content with their position in the college football landscape. I don’t buy it. It’s just that changing it is more luck than making the right moves.

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  111. The way Pitt played in it’s last 2 games I’d take Eastern Michigan and the points. History could well be repeating itself with two seasons ending with 3 consecutive losses.—-As a side note, I think Paris Ford is gone regardless of whatever round the NFL slots him in for. in next years draft. The NFL paycheck is a far better option than paying another season at Pitt. One only has to look at the minimum wage scale for anyone that makes a NFL roster to see why I’m predicting he’s gone.

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  112. I have been pretty much on the pro-Narduzzi side of things here and have produced a lot of data similar what Osbourne provided above to support my viewpoint. And I continue to maintain that he has been as good as any HC Pitt has had over the past 30 years, all thing considered.

    Since Heather has raised the salary 2 years ago to be more competitive with other Costal salaries (remember, Duzz was hired at approx. $1.8M), he has pretty much been competitive. While I still think letting him go would definitely be premature, if the program doesn’t improve to at least 8 or 9 regular season wins next year, the AD should start looking around. But again, she better have a proper replacement in hand before doing anything.

    BC just fired a coach with a slightly above .500 record (57-55) His took over a 2-10 team and was 7-6 his first year. And aside from a 3-9 record in his 3rd season, he has won 7 games every year. This year he is 6-6, I hope the BC AD has someone in mind for his own sake

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  113. As concerns ones satisfaction with the teams outcome this year, no I’m not satisfied. Firstly, I picked a record of 9-4 and secondly looking past the record, the “eye test” for the Pitt offense was horrendous this year with no improvement as the season went and no solid wins even against our lesser opponents. If Pitt lays an egg in the bowl, meaning if the conclusion is still in question in the 4th quarter (win or lose), I am not satisfied with the season. H2P!

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  114. I don’t often disagree with Iek here but I have stated it here already that I see NO WAY we beat much of anybody in our bowel game and especially not an academy team like Navy, even in one of their normal years.
    Our lack of discipline will cost us and although this year we may have gotten our most favorable match up, I will not be surprised if ugly undisciplined Pitt shows up with multiple penalties, drops and fumbles to make it close and possibly another embarrassing loss.

    Problem is, it will only be embarrassing to me and other fans, not to the players much if any at all.

    If I’m wrong, I will be happy, not thrilled to beat EMU and get to 8 wins. As far as I’m concerned, I have gotten back to the apathy stage and it isn’t so much the coaches or style of ball, but the players collapse in the last couple of games that makes me think this way. Hope I’m wrong and they scrape up some pride and put together a complete game, but even if EMU is weak, no way do we do that for 4 quarters.

    On to Pitt basketball and all things wrestling. Kid is 9-0 and Pitt is off to a great start too. We will attend the UMD dual v Pitt here at College Park on the 20th.

    H2P!!!

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Good Luck to “The Kid” T-man. Always OK to disagree with me. I have been wrong once or twice……… maybe more… 🙂

      Like

  115. BC AD and our AD worked together for years. Neither had the appropriate experience for their current roles. When you don’t know what to do, fire people because it makes you look busy! Good grief! That’s all i can type on that for now.

    My season prediction was 7-6. I thought they would get a better draw for a bowl….and lose! Just my thought. Believe me, I wish I was wrong. I wish we could put up 10 wins each year. It’s doable with the right effort! It can happen when the Administration, the AD, Faculty, Students, Media, Fans and Coaches all pull in the same direction. Call it corny, but row the boat is just what I’ve been saying for…..ever!

    Only one person rowing on one side of the boat and you go in circles. Two on the same side and you go in circles faster. That has been Pitt for almost 40 years. Everybody needs to row equally and in unison. Pitt doesn’t get it.

    With respect to Ford going pro, what does he have to look forward to if he comes back? I hope he does because it makes the team better. Will he be next year’s excuse as to why we are at 7-5 again? Seriously folks. Excuses are great when your team finishes 11-1 and you have to explain ONE loss. You can’t excuse away 5 losses, but we try hard to do just that.

    Tim Foli was a great winner, a terrible loser and a superb competitor. He hated losing so bad that he slept on second base one night after a poor ball game. He cared. Pitt does not care! Extend everybody!

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    1. “I wish we could put up 10 wins each year. It’s doable with the right effort!”

      No it is absolutely not, and this right here is the problem with Pitt’s fanbase. Pitt doesn’t have the infrastructure to just “try harder!” and conjure up these magical 10 win seasons, and because they don’t, these ill-informed fans think they are being cheated and they stop supporting the program. It’s the mentality that comes with being in a professional sports town, and it also comes from people who were around from 1975-1982 and think that all of that was just a product of “trying hard enough.”

      Liked by 3 people

      1. I agree. One 10 win year since ’82. Further, some will point out Pitt could have easily had 2 or 3 more wins this year … but remember, it also could have had 2 or 3 more losses.

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      2. I disagree. How do you explain the run we had from 72 into the 80’s? It didn’t just fall into their laps. They hired an innovator in majors. He recruited one of the best college running backs in history. He rebranded with new uniforms and the university spent money on many many many scholarships which prompted a rule change. So yes, it can be done with the proper commitment

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        1. he also recruited 85 players in one year (NOT A LIE), and Western PA was as good as any area for high school recruiting back then …. both of these ships have long sailed

          Liked by 1 person

      3. 10 wins every 4 years when the seniors are the bulk of the team. That’s all we ask. When was the last time that happened?

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  116. off topic but just read where 3 of the 4 starting QBs in the CFP are transfers. Just another rule allowing the rich to get richer.

    Oklahoma QB Jalen Hurts transferred from Bama, becoming the 3rd transfer starter at OU in a row, The previous two won the Heisman

    LSU Joe Burrow transferred from OSU leaving an opening when last year starter opted for the draft. Georgia back-up QB Justin Field then transferred to OSU, and immediately was given a waiver of eligibility. Both Hurts and Burrow were grad transfers

    Of course, all listed above are 4-stars as are the ones they replaced

    Liked by 1 person

    1. It’s hilarious when Pitt fans bash Narduzzi for hitting the portal because they think he should have recruited a kid and groomed him while these big schools have to hit the portal for the most important position on the team.

      Liked by 1 person

  117. Someone mentioned Lykke’s job is to campaign for the best bowl game (TX?) … she may have done it. Everyone harps how important a bowl win is for the program … no excuses for this one.

    Bowl win or not, this season cannot really be considered a success or momentum building.

    Duzz et al have to go back to the drawing board … how do they field an exciting football team that loses less than 3 games a season? Playing conservative, close games, is not that answer …

    Liked by 2 people

    1. While Tx Panther makes some good points here, blaming Heather for not getting a better bowl is not one of them. SHE HAS NO LEVERAGE HERE ,,, NONE ,, NADA ,,,, ZILCH

      Liked by 1 person

  118. wwb – I’m actually a big fan of Heather’s. I think she’s done a really good job gutting the all sports outside of football. Football, believe it or not, was the most consistent sport at Pitt. We were last in the Director’s Cup for a reason … Should not be this season. Volleyball, Wrestling, Men’s Soccer all showing well.

    At some point she does have to address Pitt football, however … and I actually think getting a winnable bowl game is smart since there are obviously a lot of people who care about a bowl win … even if myself, the players and coaches don’t. lol.

    I totally get why she hasn’t messed with football yet. Get the athletic department on track, let football keep winning 7 or 8 games while she fixes the other mess … then, finally, fix football with an already steady athletic department with a culture of winning.

    Liked by 8 people

    1. What? A reasonable and strategic view of things on the POV? Welcome back TT.

      Of course this does very little to stir up controversy, which is the lifeblood of our discussions…

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  119. First off, Lyke didn’t get” a winnable bowl…it was Pitt’s only option.

    Secondly, while it is fine to compare PN’s record to other Pitt HCs, isn’t the issue to try to be better than past results? Pitt has had two decent seasons in forever and those were 9 and 10 wins. I thought the whole point of PN’s hiring, his large salary and as Pat Bostick told me…”Pitt opened the bank in recruiting funds for Narduzzi”.

    So where are the results? Not in the Southside apparently.

    Also, blaming the last two losses on the players is ridiculous. It is the job of the coaching staff to get the most out of each player’s talent level. If that isn’t happening you sit that kid down. But apparently PN himself feels that there is no depth on the roster because he rarely, if ever, sits kids down for poor play.

    Liked by 4 people

    1. Didn’t get a chance to watch the BC game but it is my understanding that Ulizio and Mathews were responsible for the false penalties. Both are seniors and I don’t recall either of them having issues with penalties this year.

      I am not aware of who had the 3 fumbles, but not ware of any one person with fumbles issues … I may be wrong

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    2. PITT 7-5 who beat a 6-6 UNC team then gets overlooked by the Military bowl committee. Shame on them, not PITT.

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    3. I disagree. Too much coincidence with Pitt getting Heather’s old school. I’m sure there were negotiations for this particular opponent. There is a lot of lobbying for what bowl games will be played by who.

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  120. Therran Coleman in transfer portal.

    Kind of hoping some of the WR who haven’t seen the field will move on to open scholarships…

    Go Pitt.

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  121. wwb posted above

    off topic but just read where 3 of the 4 starting QBs in the CFP are transfers. Just another rule allowing the rich to get richer.

    Oklahoma QB Jalen Hurts transferred from Bama, becoming the 3rd transfer starter at OU in a row, The previous two won the Heisman

    LSU Joe Burrow transferred from OSU leaving an opening when last year starter opted for the draft. Georgia back-up QB Justin Field then transferred to OSU, and immediately was given a waiver of eligibility. Both Hurts and Burrow were grad transfers

    Of course, all listed above are 4-stars as are the ones they replaced

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    I’ve been told that transfers are a sign of weak recruiting? Looks like PITT were way way ahead of the game reeling in Nate Peterman when they did. Brilliant!

    Liked by 1 person

  123. Listen, we are like the last kid to be picked for a team in gym class. Yup, last pick Pitt. I’ve said for years it’s image and perception. We have done a terrible job in both areas. Couldn’t gain traction even with the Connor team, and I will never, ever, figure out how Duzz lost 5 games with that team. Beating PSU and Clemson and still losing 5?.
    Heck, we are below the other Yankee teams. We will never, ever, get a fair shake. As far as Heather, I have no animosity toward her, but I also give no credit for her cleaning house, she just did her job. No more, no less. That’s what I would expect from any competent administrator. Barnes and he who shall not be named excluded. Then again, who was the last great AD we had? And don’t you dare say SP l. I guess you have to go all the way to Cas. Man, thinking about it, our ADs were ALOT worse than even our coaches. Gee, now I’m depressed. Heck, I liked it better when I didn’t care!

    Liked by 1 person

    1. So JoeK, why and how did PITT become the nerd and last pick? They beat UNC and finished with a better record? That’s on the bowl people and not PITT

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      1. Because pitt averaging 19 points a game is BORING! UCB has a famous coach and a hot shot QB who can run and throw. Perception may not be everything, but it is something

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          1. Absolutely, a win is a win, but perception wise and eye test and watch ability, unc is more attractive to bowl promoters

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  124. Good stuff POVerts…points and counterpoints…realists vs the unreal…Hannity and Colmes…Reeds back…I’m loving it!
    This is what sucked me into the POV in the first place.

    Liked by 2 people

  125. Good news…Heather lyke hired EMU’s coach. We all know that she couldn’t run a successful lemonade stand so Pitt should win by 40…right tex!?!?

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  126. One stat that says it all: I read where Pitt had 25 penalties in its first for games and 30 penalties in its last four games. Some progress!

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    1. Just a different way of spelling the same name… had a new one the other day “ Dimensia” . My proper name is Sherman, therefore, I go by “Bernie,”

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  130. So I took a week off the POV to attempt to recover from being in the deep Pitt doldrums, and when I come back, I see Coach Duzz is still our Coach.

    What’s up with that? 🤔

    Go Pitt.

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  131. Not that he needs me to do it, but I feel compelled to come to Tex’s defense. There is nothing wrong with expecting our AD, coaches, players and administrators to aspire to achieve greater than mediocre results. We DO spend a lot of money for the results we get. We had a top ten defense yet lost 5 games. You can blame coaching for at least 2, perhaps more, of those losses. If we were in a division with better teams, I would be more understanding. But do any of you really believe that Virginia and Virginia Tech should be better than we are? I could understand if Miami was better. But they are a bigger train wreck than we are.

    I speak for myself and for nobody else when I say I’m tired of 6-7 win seasons. I’m tired of playing in crappy bowls, Remember, Houston recovering two onside kicks? Or the 3-0 SunBowl debacle? Cincinnati/Gilyard game? Getting pounded by Navy in the Military? There are many of you who have been through more misery than me. But I live 5 hours from campus, and have been making the trip for 20 years. Have had season tickets since 1988. That’s a lot of long rides home on Sunday. I’ve been committed. Ironically, probably the best ending to a season we’ve had in the last 25 years was a win that still resulted in a losing record (5-7 the year of 13-9). That’s pretty sad.

    So I love Tex’s passion. If it rubs some of you wrong, so be it. But his message isn’t off the mark: if we aren’t achieving better than mediocre results, then find someone (AD, Head Coach, assistants) who will do better. I happen to think most coaches deserve 5 or 6 years, so maybe Tex and I think a little differently there. But credit the guy for believing that we should and can be better.

    Liked by 6 people

  133. I love Tx, it’s just we are exactly the opposite. He’s Yin, I’m Yang. 🙂

    So happy you’re doing so fine my friend Eric!

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  134. Taking transfers and promising them playing time without going through years of practice equity with their teammates can be destructive to everyone’s confidence and quickly becomes political. Noone should be promised a position for transferring in, but think about that for a minute. The hotshot qb Browne, our OL(Ulazyo, or the guard from TX, etc) the last couple of years, the TE the last three years.

    Look, for the most part, kids don’t graduate and go into the portal if they had the talent to go to the nfl. For the most part, these are the rejects that are out of options. Yes, every once in awhile, you strike gold, but for the most part, not so much. Simple solution. Recruit better.

    It hurts team morale if you are an OL in Pitt’s locker room and for the last few years, Narduzzi brings in linemen that are not that talented, promises them playing time, give them playing time…..and they are average. It’s not a motivator! The big programs take very few of them to compliment a great roster. We take em because our recruiting is so bad.

    Liked by 2 people

  135. @Ike – just saw your transfer note on qb. You mentioned Peterman but not Browne? Pitt isn’t brilliant. We use too many. The other programs use the portal as a compliment and perhaps final piece to a puzzle. We just look puzzled. Have a real strategy and the transfer better be better. If even, reward your own guys that have stayed with the program.

    Hurts vs. Tua – Okay, Tua is a 5 star that plays to his ranking. He beat out Hurts. Hurts has a choice. He didn’t stink, he just wasn’t as good as Tua.

    Burrow vs Fields – Okay, Fields is a 5 star that became immediately eligible in the portal due to personal issues. Fields is better than Burrow. Burrow was not a proven commodity, but if you watched him practice, he was excellent. The problem was that Fields was more excellent.

    Fields vs. Fromm. Fromm leads Ga to national championship game. Good luck unseating him. Fields has personal issue at ga and gets to enter portal and not sit out.

    Lawrence is not in portal from clempson, but he forced out Kelly Bryant who went to Missouri and got them to a 6-6 record.

    You guys make me laugh. So now, our AD was strategic and tried to get a bowl against the weakest opponent possible so we could get to 8 wins….laughable. She commands no respect with bowl committees. She can posture the program for a better bowl if she knew how and had collateral to work with. She cant call in any favors because there are no favors that she has given (quid pro quo).

    Liked by 1 person

    1. LOL Huff the Third, I don’t think anyone has suggested that Heather manipulated a winnable bowl game by any means and yes, that comment actually did make me laugh out loud. Boy, you really have it out for Heather don’t you? << I could see your point if PITT actually has had a parade of great AD’s in the past (they haven’t) and PITT’s other president sports weren’t picking up (they are) to hold such a disdain for her. Look, she sits right next to Narduzzi in my mind of someone doing a decent job and doing the best he/she can with what he/she signed up for. just imo. Having said that, they both could go tomorrow and I wouldn’t care one bit. What was it again that I have been accused of doing? Singing Narduzzi praises, will the real realist please stand up. 🙂

      When a thought crosses ones mind to the degree that you either like that person or dislike that person your opinion is no longer valid in my opinion on that subject and it certainly isn’t being real. It’s simply your opinion which I respect deeply. When a person no longer Lykes someone they will never do any right in ones mind eye. Again, I certainly respect your thoughts though.

      Anyone remember the bridge to nowhere in downtown Pittsburgh that was supposed to lead to the north shore? It’s no longer there physically but I think mentally it is. I can appreciate any good when good is an achievement even though it may fall below other schools main goals and dreams. PITT is PITT and I recognize that. So lets fire Narduzzi and Heather and start dreaming over again and see where it lands us all. I’ll sit this next change out though, I’m too tired for another change. iek.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Heather is one of the lowest paid AD’s in all of P-5
        That goes to show you that Pitt is NOT serious about sports

        How would you grade her ike on the following:

        season ticket sales/attendance
        marketing
        branding
        revenue generation
        donations/fundraising
        capital investments
        coaching hires
        overall sports competitiveness
        compliance
        finance

        There is a reason why she isnt worth $1M which happens to be the going rate for ACC AD’s

        You get what you pay for.

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        1. Pitt was a rock bottom athletic department with 30+ years of mostly neglect that pays its AD nil and has a 40th ranked football coaching salary. Your beef is with the BoT not Heather and Duzz. I, personally, think Heather has been kicking ass. She has Pitt just outside of Nike’s top 30 (all sports not just college) so the branding is going pretty well. Several programs on the rise. So much so we joke that Pitt is a women’s volleyball school or men’s soccer school. Everyone wants instant gratification but Pitt is not the school to do that. I know you point to the director’s cup but she literally gutted 95% of Pitt athletic department. It had to hit rock bottom before rising from the ashes. She’ll get to football. And I can tell you what to expect. A rising assistant from Clemson. Her MO is assistant coaches from winning programs in the ACC.

          You call it out. You get what you pay for. I don’t understand why you get so bent at Pitt’s performance when you already know the why.

          I do think Heather is doing it the right way. She observed for a year. Then decided everything was broke and fired everyone. Last year Pitt paid the consequences of that in the Director’s Cup but I expect a steady rise over the next few years.

          Mark my words, she’ll get to football. It’s just the least broke but requires the most work to fix.

          Liked by 5 people

  136. Huff, Fields, Hurts or Burrow would never even consider coming to PITT. We were lucky getting Peterman who was recruited to Tennessee by our then OC Chaney.. Brown, George and the well traveled kid named Ricky Townes were warm bodies in positions of need that didn’t pan out wherever they set foot. Like getting a third tier bowl the transfer portal will most likely deliver us 2nd tier players. I would take a few more Kylan Johnson’s any day …..

    Liked by 1 person

    1. That was part of my point. I think there was some cherry-picking on the final 4 playoff team qb’s that all just happened to be in the portal and that nard is doing great with the portal because he once got Peterman who executed the offense well. The portal is not designed for filling multiple positions, that is called recruiting and understanding balanced recruiting.

      I totally agree BigB that Pitt couldn’t get any of those 3 guys in the playoff. I was trying to type that you can’t make a living as a head coach getting a bunch of re-treads for the most part! There is an occasional Peterman, but for the most part, these kids washed out. Johnson did well this year, but did his promise of playing time make the other linebacker quit? That is my larger point. When nard and company promise these transfers the “first” opportunity, it is a slap in the face of those that put in the time. Players are resentful.

      Liked by 1 person

  137. BTW, PITT fans made a great fan showing at the Military Bowl 4 years ago. PITT asked for extra tickets after the first allotment was sold out. Shame on the Military Bowl committee. PITT beat UNC and had a better record. That’s on them not PITT, Narduzzi or Heather! << This is what I mean when I say I defend and not sing the praises of these people.

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  138. Rejoining the land of the living this morning. Three weeks from the surgery and I almost feel human again.
    Walking without a cane, but still a long way to go with range of motion, progress being made though.
    Thanks to BigB for his professional Advice and all POV well wishers. Still taking pain meds at night but fairly clear headed during the day.

    Liked by 4 people

  140. GC… I second that… For all of you perspective candidates for total knee replacements there are many of you in wait- Most of you or just on aware at this time…Some advice – the initial focus is on getting the range of motion first … That is fundamental to having an excellent outcome… It’s kind a like the exchange between the quarterback in the center… Screw that up and nothing good happens… Glad you’re getting back in action Gordon… Sometime this winter Fran and I want to get the golfing POVerts to Annie’s cousins indoor range in golf shop in GreensburgFor a little match on a cold and snowy day… We went last year and had a blast… Cousin Joe is A-OK… You can bring your cooler full of beer and order food and play golf… I don’t know why anyone would ever want to play on real grass after visiting his place on route 30 by the mall in Greensburg

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Been to Corsi’s many times. Never as a group which I would enjoy with you guys.

      I have to be careful though, one year while getting ready for Myrtle, I developed golfers elbow from hitting off the mats. I have to adjust my swing to stop hitting down on the ball.

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    3. I was there two weeks ago, Bernie. Joe is also a Pitt guy in case you didn’t know. Also a heck of a golfer. When I lived in WPA 25 years ago, he and I were both members at Ligonier CC.

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  141. So going way off topic this morning since so far a slow news day. Rene Auberjonois, a very fine actor died yesterday. I mention this because when I was in 10th grade at Penn Hills High, I had a fine teacher for Project English whose hobby was the theater. As part of the class she would take us on a school bus to the Pittsburgh Public Theater on Craft Avenue. It has recently been rebuilt in the city and is operated by Point Park College. When I went there Rene Auberjonois was a student at Carnegie Tech which has a fine drama department. I got to see him as the lead in King Lear, Tartuffe and a couple others. I also saw Death of a Salesman, but I don’t think he was in it. In any case what an experience. It was easy to see that he had “it”.

    He went right from there to Broadway where he won a “Tony” and then to Hollywood for a long TV and Movie career.

    I was very fortunate to have a teacher that went the extra mile for her students and to have such a great experience.

    I often wondered what would have happened if I would have chosen drama, instead of sports for my after school activity. Back then almost impossible to do both.

    Flash forward to my Pitt years when I met a few students from Pitt’s fledgling drama department, a fellow by the name of Casey who was a strong Director and transferred to CMU. Last time I heard he was working on Broadway, I wonder whatever happened to him?.

    During my last year in Grad school, I lived on the infamous Chesterfield Rd and my room was the attic, you entered from a trap door. There was a group of five or more Pitt Drama females that lived next door. One night they were in their attic, obviously drinking and singing “Working in a Coal Mine” so me and my roommates joined in the harmony or lack thereof from our side. One of them became a “friend with benefits” who would surprise me with late night or early morning “Booty Calls” both terms hadn’t been invented yet.
    She also went off to New York to try to “make it”. I always wondered what her and her roommates lives were like. They worked at their craft as hard as any engineer I met at Pitt and practically lived in the Stephen Foster theater.

    In any case I wouldn’t trade my experiences at Pitt for anything, being in a City School gives a student a much wider range of experiences and people on and off campus.

    Liked by 1 person

    2. I remember Rene from my favorite Star Trek series – Deep Space Nine. Probably the only person on earth who considers that show as the best. Actually watch Star Trek Voyager on BBC as I type.

      Some great memories of college life.

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  142. Speaking of golf, since I can’t play for a while. I just read Harvey Penick’s little Red Book for the second time, and am half way through Ben Hogan’s Five Lessons, probably the best tutorial, I have ever read, Wish I would have read it years ago. Also, Reading Mickelson’s Short Game and watching the video, pretty good.
    Got Pelz’s putting book but it is two inches thick. Hogan’s is a quarter inch.

    Looking forward to the President’s Cup this week.

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  143. Good stuff Gordon…I’m a fan of Penick also. Loved his “take dead aim” stamped on his clubs.
    I’m in for the Corsis roadtrip…

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  144. Time to knock off a myth. Yes, I guess an experienced HC with a successful record would be an optimal hire .. and sure enough, Norvell went to FSU, Kiffin to Ole Miss, and the Appalachian St coach went to Missouri (after only 1 year as a HC)

    But are you all aware that 3 of the 4 HCs in the national playoffs are all assistant coaches in their 1st stint as HC? And the 4th, Ed Odgeron (LSU) was a failure at Ole Miss (2005-7) and an interim HC at USC (2016)

    I keep telling you that the PROGRAM is more important than the coach. Chip Kelly took over a very good program at Oregon, and was so good he was hired by the Eagles but lasted 3 years. Now, he took a failing program at UCLA and is only 7-17 the past 2 years.

    Gary Anderson was 24-22 at Utah St when Barry Alvarez hired him at Wisconsin and he won 9 and 10 games in his 2 years there. He went to Ore St and was 7 and 23 in 2 1/2 years before he walked,

    Don’t get me wrong, if Duzz is let go and Pitt can get Billy Napier or Luke Fickell, I am OK … but don’t expect miracles

    Liked by 4 people

    1. There is nothing at all wrong with hiring long time assistants; just like hiring head coaches, sometimes they work out and sometimes they don’t. I think criticizing Narduzzi is fair game, but doing so because he was a former assistant coach is just an easy way out to support an agenda, it makes no sense at all. Actually, the crosstown hillbillies did well with Holgy (former assistant at TT), and recently hired a former HC instead in Brown who is probably a decent coach, but appears to be a downgrade. If hiring head coaches was easy, big schools like Michigan, USC and Texas (to name a few) wouldn’t screw up so often.

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  145. I met “cousin Joe” years ago (55 years ago) as he’s my best buddies cousin also. Of course he’s Annie’s cousin as well. Great family. Joe is from Carbon, tell Joe I said hello.

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    2. using the NFL protocol is recommended for all underclassmen considering going pro. They will do an evaluation and let the player know of his draftability … i.e., whether he will be drafted and if so, approx. what round. If the player decides no to opt for the NFL, he will remain eligible as long as he has stayed a student and hasn’t signed with an agent

      Like

    2. After 45 years I finally took putting lessons this year. Took 5-6 strokes off my game. Oh, the little things I was doing wrong. I highly recommend…but not for $20k

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  148. Watched my 1st NFL games in 3-4 years on Saturday…the Bills…love to see them doing better and talking ’bout fans-theirs have weathered many a bad season and they hang in their with unrelenting love for their team…compare that to the Patriot fans…Pats lose a couple of games and are soundly booed off the field by their home crowd….oh well…Go Bills !!!

    Liked by 1 person

    1. I lived in Buffalo for 8 years. Bills fans are just as rabid as Steelers fans. The entire city goes quiet during the games…nobody is on the roads or in the stores. They also support their Sabres extremely well and always have one of the highest TV ratings for playoff games. A great sports city and the food cant be beat. The weather is a different story.

      Liked by 1 person

  149. Regarding the Military Bowl, UNC is an ACC favorite. We will always be behind them. Period.
    MD constantly complained about the ACC always having them in the dog house.

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    1. ACC Commish John Swofford is a UNC alum, and MD complaints about UNC were minor compare to Clemson’s complaints about them earlier this decade …. basketball related. I have no doubt that his status was a big factor in UNC getting only a slap on the wrist in its recent NCAA scandal

      Liked by 1 person

  150. First off those QB transfers to the playoff schools have nothing whatsoever to do with transfers to Pitt.

    Everyone and his brother wants to play at Clemson, OSU, etc…those big dog schools have the pick of anyone in the transfer portal.

    Pitt gets kids that either can’t get starting jobs at their old school or who parted ways with the old staff.

    How have all the transfer TEs done at Pitt…? The more you pull in below average players at a position through transfers the less good recruits at that position want to go to that school.

    My word, we went from JP Holtz and Scotty Orndof to the bum TE of the week club.

    How about Brown at QB? The numerous OL transfers have been OK at best.

    We can point to WPA HS’s lack of strong talent as an excuse but, again, PN was handed the largest recruiting budget (by far) and the use of a chartered jet to roam the other recruiting areas so he should be getting good enough players that should preclude the need to bring in average at best transfers.

    But to me PN’s true problem is his stubborn attitude. I mentioned earlier his weird reluctance to change out poor performers. You can look at Pickett’s yards passing and get completely bamboozled as to his actual effectiveness as a QB. He sucked at producing points on the scoreboard. That was a result of being 96th of 110 ranked QBs with a 117.9 effeciency rating. Which is the worse as a season long starting Pitt QB in forever. Brown was at 140!

    If that didn’t justify sitting down a poor performer what in hell does? I firmly believe Patti would have put more points on the board had he been given any decent chance to.

    PN will talk a big game about competition in camp but that never happens…and so this is what we get.

    Again, this is an area where his recruiting has been poor before and completely one-sided toward defense. Thus the need to grab kids out of the portal and

    Liked by 1 person

    1. the off-season should be interesting. Will Patti and Davis be given consideration in replacing Pickett? I kind of doubt it but we’ll see.

      I still say the OL is the biggest contributor to Pitt’s offensive failures. IMO, Pitt badly needs (1) more balance on offense, and (2) be able a gain a yard or two when needed on the ground, and not having to pass for it

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      1. Crazy how good we were in ’18 with the run game …added 3 new lineman, a new OC and minus one George the animal…hopefully the OL gets better,,Whip’s O had to have some affect on their play after transition from the Watsonman-they will get stronger and so will all other teams…False-start Bookser….the last solid bunch of locals went to ND and then there is this Bleich kid, a local yocal who has bounced around…Has to be a kid who could pack on the pounds and grow into a TE or a TE who could grow into an OT ala O’Neil

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  151. First off those QB transfers to the playoff schools have nothing whatsoever to do with transfers to Pitt.

    Everyone and his brother wants to play at Clemson, OSU, etc…those big dog schools have the pick of anyone in the transfer portal.

    Pitt gets kids that either can get starting jobs at their old school or who parted ways with the old staff.

    How have all the transfer TEs done at Pitt…? The more you pull in below average players at a position through transfers the less good recruits at that position want to go to that school.

    My word, we went from JP Holtz and Scotty Oendof to the bum TE of the week club.

    How about Brown at QB? The numerous OL transfers have been OK at best.

    We can point to WPA HS’s lack of strong talent as an excuse but, again, PN was handed the largest recruiting budget (by far) and the use of a chartered jet to roam the other recruiting areas so he should be getting good enough players that should preclude the need to bring in average at best transfers.

    But to me PN’s true problem is his stubborn attitude. I mentioned earlier his weird reluctance to change out poor performers. You can look at Pickett’s yards passing and get completely bamboozled as to his actual effectiveness as a QB. He sucked at producing points on the scoreboard. That was a result of being 96th of 110 ranked QBs with a 117.9 effeciency rating. Which is the worse as a season starting Pitt QB in forever. Hell, Max Brown was over 140 alone.

    If that didn’t justify sitting down poor players what in hell does? I firmly believe Patti would have put more points on the board had he been given any fair chance to.

    PN will talk a big game about competition in camp but that never happens…and so this is what we get.

    Again, this is an area where his recruiting has been poor before and completely one-sided toward defense. Thus the need to grab kids out of the portal.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. players see this and it does impact team chemistry and on the field performance.

      You always want your best players on the field. Not necessarily the most experienced ones
      the ones with talent who can execute their assignments

      problem is that Pitt has dearth talent in key positions like RB, WR, QB, OL…basically all of the offense
      and the players are undisciplined and not executing…not knowing the basics of blocking, tackling and catching the ball.

      We have choir boys on the field and not football players
      They are too busy practicing saving kittens from high trees on the Cathedral lawn instead of getting in a good practice on the Southside

      But we fans wouldnt know because Meatballs doesnt open his practices

      Liked by 1 person

  153. Reed, I agree with all you said…would love to see how a proven recruiter would do at PITT…would be cool to have a coach who made us all feel warm and fuzzy….I think back to the Dave Hart, DePasquale and Hackett days when I want to feel real gloomy…..

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    1. No proven recruiter on earth is going to test his chops convincing kids to play their games at Heinz Field.

      If the coach thinks he can do it, his agent won’t. When the coach tells his agent he can do it, the agent is then floored at how little Pitt is willing to pay in the school’s infamous “Prove It” contract.

      And we wonder why we wallow in mediocrity.

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      1. thats why Pitt needs to publicly announce a feasibility study for a smaller MPC on campus

        And they should disclose the NHL findings from their college hockey feasibility study. Pitt was being studied. Pitt is not transparent.

        I’m 100% sure that college hockey would be highly successful at Pitt. Pitt could become a elite hockey power but Heather again is clueless.

        Pitt thinks so small

        Alumni and fans will rally behind big ideas which are properly crafted and sold. I’d do that work pro bono. All I ask for is a brick with my name on it above some piss trough…yes, above and not in the trough since I dont want to be pissed on. 🙂

        Liked by 1 person

    1. I was a student during those Hackett days and early Major 2 years. That was a very dark period for Pitt football. Pitt lost an entire generation of fans over that decade of futility.

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      1. Solely to blame for the 1990s: it will come as a surprise I’m sure, but the administration.

        Tearing down what Gottfried was building up.

        Liked by 1 person

        1. Gottfried did recruit some thugs but they sure could play football. Pitt de-emphasized football yet again and went cheap. The mission statement was more important than maintaining the front porch.

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  155. Transfers should have a fair opportunity to win a job, but that’s it. A major question this year is why no one on the roster was good enough to eventually beat Ulizio out at RT.

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  156. The challenge at Pitt for 30+ years has been how to get enough decent players on the roster to be competitive. The only things that have changed are that kids can go pro earlier, or can transfer after they graduate if they have eligibility left. Kids have always been able to transfer if willing to sit out, but now some times they don’t even have to miss a year, which I don’t understand.

    While Narduzzi’s offensive recruiting has been subpar, some of his defensive guys are good enough to think about going pro early, which also hurts the overall roster. So far no danger of an offensive player leaving early for the NFL.

    Unfortunately after all the elite schools take the vast majority of the best players, the rest of us do the best we can. In Pitt’s case there are additional obstacles or as Tex calls them excuses. Unfortunately they are very real and not easily overcome.

    The ACC Championship game once again showed the difference between the haves and have nots.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. gc, I don’t understand why PITT just doesn’t fire Narduzzi and Heather? Then become a national powerhouse in college football. It’s not that hard, just fire these people and start winning. Then all of a sudden the PITT football fans will start to attend games in masses and the yellow seats will no longer be yellow but filled with blue and gold. OR PITT can magically build an on campus stadium on top of the Cathedral of Learning. << Wouldn’t that be great? While PITT is at it, they should click their heels together and twinkle their nose and consider building a Stairway to the Stars. Easy Peezy right?

      Liked by 4 people

  159. Neither the Bowls or the ACC are going to do us any favors, nor should they until we earn it.

    Must be a pretty good story behind Raines, but it is possible he was over rated, we’ve seen it before.

    I would also question the intelligence of any defensive back that wants to play in that conference.

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    1. Seriously gc, the Military bowl screwed PITT by taking a team with a worse record and a team that PITT beat this year. This one is not on PITT.

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  160. BTW, The Kent State O-Lineman was pretty dam good. Considering how much he was maligned on the POV he was actually a home-run transfer. PITT and Narduzzi were way ahead of the game at the time. Sometimes you win and sometimes you don’t.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Reed puts great emphasis on making the 1’st or 2’nd team All ACC team. Stefano Millin was 2’nd team All ACC in his only year in the ACC. IMO, he has never been given he accolades he deserves.

      I believe it was because as you said Ike, he was much maligned.

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  161. He was a good one for college…wonder how our season would have ended if he didn’t land on Jimmy’s ankle…probably the same- 3 game losing streak……so damn depressing…PITT FB is mentally traumatizing-need to lay down on Fran’s couch and have his psychiatrist wife diagnose my disorder…What does she charge Lastrow???

    Liked by 2 people

  162. So, help me out here – I am somewhat confused. At the beginning of the year, we bi+ch about too many tough teams on our schedule. Then at year’s end we bi+ch about getting handed a cream puff that no one will travel to see. What am I missing???

    Also, we all know the definition of Insanity, right? So, why do we keep firing coaches because they can’t recruit talented players. And to no one’s surprise, the next man up can’t recruit, either. Been going on for most of 35-40 years. Could there possibly be something else that maybe we are overlooking – or afraid to admit???

    Inquiring minds want to know!

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Pitt had recruited good players throughout the 80s but except for a few local gems and what Charlie Partridge was able to bring in for Harris, Wanny and Duzz, recruiting is a challenge for Pitt. And IMO it gets down to the same issue why Pitt is snubbed for bowls …. attendance.

      Kids go to a packed game with rabid fanbases at PSU, WVU, ND, etc. and then they go to Heinz (or visa versa). When comparing game atmospheres with whom Pitt has to compete with for recruits, Pitt will likely lose

      Liked by 2 people

      1. Playing in a stadium too big for Pitts needs is a problem. Plus it’s bland, devoid of charm and character. Built cheap. It’s ugly and not inspiring. If Pitt was smart which it isn’t, it would begin a feasibility study. Atmosphere matters for the experience. Pitt also needs more revenue streams and a M P C fits that bill. Victory heights needs to have an M P C as its focal point. There is a reason why fundraising for this project is far below Pitts goals. So Pitt will go into massive debt to provide a new home for volleyball and wrestling which is a waste of money. Pitt needs to think bigger. And football pays the bills.

        A smaller, more intimate and uniquely Pitt venue will wow everyone. You don’t need 100k fans in a stadium to be impressed. 45k in a 45k stadium is electric.

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        1. Well the lease runs for how many more years? So nothing is happening until that is over at the very least

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          1. Pitt can collect 100 percent of the revenue streams from their venue unlike Heinz. Why wait. Plus the venue would be used more than 7 times per year since it would support multiple programs and events.

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      2. Maybe we could offer season tickets for Steeler home games as part of our scholarship package… guaranteed packed house and loud all my rowdy friends are coming over crowd… best of both worlds !!!

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    2. It’s the goal posts BL, it’s the goal posts they keep moving when PITT finally fields a decent team. Isn’t it interesting that all of of sudden PITT should be winning ten games a season with the lousy recruiting Narduzzi and staff have done? Some of the POV posters would make a great running back considering their ability to zig and zag.

      Liked by 1 person

  163. according to the PSN article, both Ford and Jones are exploring the NFL option and will declare for the draft if they are projected as a second rounder. I don’t see Jones going that high. Ford has 2nd round talent but maybe not right now. Getting drafted that high also depends on how many other top safeties are available but I doubt that will be figured into the draft evaluation

    Liked by 1 person

  164. Wwb is correct that it is the program not the coach. Paul Chryst is all the sudden a great coach at Wisconsin. This program has bad losses and underachieving in its DNA and it goes way back.

    Liked by 1 person

  165. Pitt is the only school that schedules weak OCC games for the bowl. They have it backward.
    You should play Eastern Michigan in September so you can play Michigan in January.
    SOP
    KMAN

    Liked by 4 people

  166. An interesting observation I had is that I believe the current coaching staff is the best overall of the Narduzzi era. But this seemed to be the worst coached team of the Narduzzi era. What gives?

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Narduzzi has closed practices

      Mistakes made by players in practice will translate to games. Yet Narduzzi refuses to bench players

      We’d see this if he wasn’t so secretive and paranoid.

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      1. closed practices
        no radio interviews
        no fan interaction
        an offense that scores 1 TD a game
        18,000 season ticket holder going lower
        no personality
        no effort at all to bring people to his team ZERO
        That is his job. Open the practice, get on TV, go see high schools, Do something!
        KMAN

        Liked by 1 person

        1. I can agree that opening practices might build connections and create buzz. But blaming this year’s poor play on that is insane.

          Liked by 1 person

      2. You’re going out on a limb there buddy. He has had closed practices throughout his tenure but this year the stupid and undisciplined play on the field showed not other years.

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      3. Again, Narduzzi is far far from the only head football coach to hold closed practices. This isn’t a Narduzzi thing.

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  167. Tex is right. Heinz is a dump. Nothing at all to like, plus giant, plus empty, plus glowing yellow for all to notice.
    Pitt should find a way to play at PNC park until we can build a new stadium to play in.
    KMAN

    Liked by 1 person

  168. Kman I like your OOC comment. Georgia Tech next year plays Ucf, Notre Dame, and Georgia next year in their OOC. Paul Johnson before he stepped down was quoted in saying, “That’s the type of schedule that will get people fired.”

    Liked by 1 person

  169. A good point above that some complain that the schedule is too hard all year and then when given a cupcake for a tidy bowl game…complain!

    The idea is not to get a cupcake after you have a strong season. Kids get confidence by winning, you get better recruits by winning, etc., you can play freshman early to give them tape on their craft, so they can improve….instead of being an observer for most games because the games are too close to play!

    Try this on for one second. Dairy HIgh, OSU, Wisconsin, Clempson, Alabama etc have 3 tough games on their schedule every year, that’s it. Anyone want to argue that? Now, on a good year, if they win 2 of those three, they are in playoff territory. It’s an easy formula and the big14 has it down scientifically. In addition, the big14 always votes their teams into the top25 because their records are so good…because they play crap doormats! Every other conference just takes it.

    Unfortunately for Pitt, the ACC and their AD, they don’t get it.

    Whoever painted with a broad brush and says WVU plays to sellouts all the time is mistaken. They don’t. Their announced crowd for the last game of the season against #21 OKSt for instance, was 46k. Most are in the 55k range with an occasional 60k. Again, announced. No biggy tho, we had 48k at our last game, says Heather. I did see a stat that ranked Pitt at 53rd for avg attendance out of 130 schools. However, it was tickets sold…and only sold 62.4% of stadium capacity. Need to reduce capacity to get a larger percentage of a full stadium. Tarp city at Steeler Stadium.

    Liked by 1 person

  170. Next year is obviously the critical one for Narduzzi. Given the amount of negativity currently being directed at the football program, expect Heather to come out soon with some kind of a vote of confidence that the program is headed in the right direction. The timing will be decided by if it is needed to salvage this year’s recruiting class.

    Recruiting is extremely critical now, and if either Patti or Beville transfer, and then Pitt loses its top QB recruit, the situation at QB would be dire. Look for another transfer to come in at QB to back up Pickett. As for the OL, there is no obvious replacement for Ulizio, or he would have been playing already. I wish I had ike’s positive outlook, but must admit things don’t look good right now.

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  171. “Dont tarp me bro”…but if you do I’m moving to the club seats (might do that anyway…with a small posse)
    OR, move to PNC park (Kmans idea)
    Pittman2003, I looked up Pitt on Ancestry.com and sure enough it said “underachiever capable of bad losses”…it IS in our DNA!

    Liked by 4 people

  172. VOR – great QB point. In ’17 and ’18, all we did was run, run, run. IMO, a talented QB would have been crazy to want to come to Pitt, just to hand off the ball. And I think the coaches heard that on the recruiting trail. I think that was a (large) part of ditching Watson, and bringing in Mr. Whipple.

    Especially after seeing how KP played this year, and how many times he threw, I would think the backups are chomping at the bit. And QB recruits would be anxious to take a shot with Pitt as well – at least that would be the selling point, if the staff uses it! (An added benefit for recruits is that they will also learn how to be a great game manager!)

    But the tough sell is convincing recruits that our receivers really can catch! (Isn’t there always a “catch”? – pun intended!)

    Liked by 1 person

  174. maybe this will get emel back here …. Central Catholic safety Gus Sunseri was offered a PWO by Pitt.

    Other CC safeties on current Pitt roster: Hamlin, Gricen, Petrishen

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    1. I know someone who contacted Emels house and was told that he can’t come to the phone at that moment. Whatever that means?? Let us know Emel…

      Liked by 1 person

  177. A bowl game in Detroit is only one spot behind a bowl game in the Bahamas?
    We must be right on the equivalent of the Mendoza Line for bowl games.

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  179. I didn’t have a chance to weigh in on a discussion yesterday but I’d like to add that I like Tex and appreciate his contributions to this forum. I especially appreciate his willingness to research and share data pertaining to a given topic. I will admit to being miffed when you contend, Tex, that those who disagree with your path forward for Pitt do so because they don’t care. But that’s your opinion and we are here to share our opinions. It’s all good and makes this site interesting.

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  180. I have disagreed with Tx on a number of occasions but there is absolutely no questions that he does his homework and research. Many times he backs up his opinions with data, and is very knowledgeable about Pitt athletics … maybe more than anyone here. I respect that.

    His expectations are higher than mine but he is likely much more emotionally involved than I am. I do think he is a little unfair with Heather though.

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  181. BTW, there is no truth to the rumor that Franklinstein is replacing his recently departed OC with Mark Whipple …. or Shawn Watson for that matter

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  182. Maybe next year PITT can land a spot in the Fairbanks Bowl? Looks like it would be a night game no matter when it’s played. Right now the sunsets at 2:44 PM up there where it’s a balmy 17 degrees. Sounds about right for PITT.

    Liked by 1 person

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