Here is a piece sent to me the other day via email. It is from our long-time reader but seldom commenter “EtnaPanther” (Mike Cvitkovic)
MY 2 CENTS
As an infrequent poster (maybe two or three comments over the years) but an avid reader of all the articles and comments posted here on the POV I thought I would take a shot at writing a short article.
Let’s start this with by stating that I am not a Pitt alumni nor is anyone else in my immediate family. My son-in-law graduated from Pitt but he started at PSU. I think maybe that should count as ½ of a Pitt relative.
I began following Pitt football began back in the early 1960’s when my Dad would take me to Pitt Stadium to watch the Panthers play on Saturday afternoons. I enjoyed the game for what it was – an afternoon watching two teams slug it out on the gridiron. We had some good teams and some good players and guess what? Nobody gave a hoot about “stars” or “rankings” back then.
Now we jump forward 50 years and fret over these recruiting websites grades assigned to the high school players. I have read the blog posts and commenters discussing the merits and necessity of 4* & 5* players. The analysis that has appeared here has been very insightful and in many cases well thought out. My only question to you readers is what are we hoping to accomplish if we sign a whole bunch of highly touted recruits?
Does it insure success on the field? No, of course not. But if it did, would we “feel” better if Pitt ended up 9-3 and played in a major bowl game?
What I am trying to say is that I, like all Pitt fans, want the team to do well. But for me that is not the bottom line. For me it is the complete game day experience. From what I read in the comments the Pitt POV tailgates are a good time. Isn’t this why we go to the games… to enjoy our family and friends and to root the Panthers to a hopeful victory?
I feel that we sometimes take the success of the recruiting and on field results too personally as fans. I am not saying you are wrong in feeling this way, but let’s be realistic here also. Do we really believe that Pitt will ever be a consistent major player again in the current college football universe? I know myself that if will be more than happy with a conference title once in, say, every 10 years.
I know some of you are saying “screw that!”. Well, we didn’t exactly tear up the Big East which was a more inferior conference to our current ACC. Am I being too pessimistic? Maybe I am, but then again I will also still enjoy the other nine years of not winning the title. Why? Because as I stated above – it’s not only about winning the games.
Now here is where I get on my soapbox.
Here in the off-season it’s fun to jab back and forth with each other about player ratings, coaches and expected results. I have read some very well thought out comments on the POV. What I dislike and disagree with is the sniping back and forth that sometimes borders on flat-out meanness. To disagree with someone is OK, but it doesn’t need to become personal. What really upsets me is when the snarky comments are directed back to the owner of this website. Reed puts a lot of time and effort into this site and I really do appreciate his work.
As my Dad would tell me, if you don’t like it, do it better yourself or shut up and don’t bitch. Well, that’s the end of my “sermon” for today. We who read and participate on this blog are in our heart of hearts dedicated Pitt fans.
HAIL TO PITT !!!
EtnaPanther (Mike Cvitkovic)
pittpov.com 
Mike, thanks so much for the article and for revisiting Old Pitt Stadium Saturday games.
I was at every Pitt home game from birth until age 22 – right through the late ’50s into the late ’70s and look back on that time as a much simpler, and truth be told, more fun time than Pitt football is today. Now it is under a microscope, which is exactly what I do also I know, and things sometimes get blown out of proportion.
But it is still great fun and thanks for your well written thoughts…
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You were a young optimist then….now you’re an enlightened realist. 😉
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Good.
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Well done Etna.
If that photo is you and grandkids, again I say well done. The kids are being raised to Lyke Pitt and that is where the growing crowds and fan base begins, IMO.
Hope to meet you at a POV tailgate. Are you a golfer?
H2P!
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If you consider yourself spending more time in the woods than the fairway, then yes I am a golfer.
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Fellow golfers are always amazed of my recovery shots from the woods, but they rarely consider the amount of practice that was for acquired such accuracy.
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I need a hunting license to golf…
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Hope that’s not a metaphor Erie..😀
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Well done Mike and much appreciated. Sounds like we are the same generation and were taught the same values. I grew up in Lawrenceville. You Croatian / Slovak?
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100% Croatian. Unfortunately I married an Irish woman so I kinda thinned out the bloodline
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Love the old picture. Good points Mike, especially about the sniping at Reed, which is absolutely uncalled for.
I do think the debate is healthy, but some guys don’t know how to keep it civil.
As far as the old days, great memories, but time marches on, just like the picture above has changed,
the Sports environment has changed. You used to have to actually go to the games to see them, very few on TV.
The biggest change was that for many of those years Pittsburgh was the city of losers, Pirates and Pitt hadn’t been winners in recent memory and the Steelers were perennial losers. The Penquins hadn’t been hatched.
Today Pittsburghers are spoiled with a record of many World Champions.
The stakes seem much higher and success is winning all the marbles.
I do agree that expectations for Pitt to win championships are and have been silly for a long time.
But the women’s softball team just won the Coastal, so maybe the Men will step up someday.
As far as the recruiting wars, at least they give us fanatics something to talk about in the off-season, and quality of players is the most important thing if you want a winning program.
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We’re a softball school 😉
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Good #2
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Well then, congratulations to the Women’s Softball Team. Way to go ladies. Super!
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Thank you for the nice article Mike and helping to put things in proper perspective . Hope you will begin to chime in more often and stop by the POV tailgate as well!
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Thanks for the article Mike and that’s a fine looking family you got there. Hope to see you guys at a tailgate this coming year. I always enjoy seeing old photo’s like that, I just look and remember ike
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Well said.
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Enjoyed the article Mike, especially the comments about some posters disagreeing with another and getting nasty about it. Remember guys (because it’s not the ladies who are guilty of this), it is possible to disagree without being disagreeable. Think of it as disagreeing with your mom- are you gonna get nasty and call her names? I hope not! And thanks to Reed for all the work he puts into the blog- some you forget to be grateful for his efforts. Don’t let comments get personal!! H2P!
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As Dave Mason said ” There’s only you and me (and the rest of the POVites) and we just disagree. Unfortunately, I haven’t figured out how to post music video links like Iek 🎼🎹🎸
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I actually saw Dave Mason play in a small dive bar in Guam of all places. His band was on a stop from Thailand to Hawaii – played two sets to about 25 people but sat and drank with us until around 2 am… great guy and his band was funny as hell.
He was one of my favorites since Traffic and had some great stories about Winwood and Capaldi and being on the road…
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Reed, I got into a minor debate once with Josh Miller (former Steeler punter) about Dave Mason. Although raised by hippie generation parents who taught him a lot about late 60’s – 70’s rock, he had mistakenly concluded that Mason was some sort of one-hit wonder. We got that sorted out, but I have found through multiple discussions with other younger adults that Mason’s contributions to music are truly underappreciated.
Mason appears in Pgh on Sat July 14th with Steve Cropper. Guessing its the Carnegie Music Hall in Homestead.
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Mike.. spoken like a true PITT fan. Your “ sermon” was truly Pittsburgh “man talk! “ Good article. Well done !
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Good points. I agree with your expectations. A conference title every ten years seems like a reasonable goal.
I think you r right that we should value the game experience more than just focusing on wins and losses. I am definitely guilty of getting too irritated when pitt loses.
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Here’s all i do Mark. I google Dave Mason we just disagree and hit search. Right on top there it is. I just copy the green link and paste the link on the POV. Wups there it is.
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Mike… thanks for sharing the family pic !
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Mike, Great post, thank you. The aerial pix off Pitt Stadium brought an instant warming of my heart. It had character and tradition.
My answer to your question “would we “feel” better if Pitt ended up 9-3 and played in a major bowl game? is a hearty YES!! As someone who lives thousands of miles away my Pitt fix is satiated through the TV and chatting on here during game day. My family for game day is other online watchers/posters.
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Good article Mike. Thank you. People take things FAR too seriously. It’s a sport, a game. It’s not life and death. What gets lost is these are young kids practicing hard and trying their best and playing their hearts out for their school and for each other.
I’ve read where at the end of the game in Nebraska, Husker fans, win or lose, stand and applaud both teams and their players for their effort. That is how it should be.
It’s great to get together on Saturdays in the fall with fellow fans and watch college football. There should be no animosity between both schools and their fans and especially amongst ourselves on Reed’s website.
Sure we’d like to see victory week-after-week. What is more important is that the players are staying out of trouble, getting a quality education and learning the merits of hard work.
I think about Jamie Dixon when he was here. I may have missed it but I don’t recall his players ever in trouble and when fans wanted his dismissal, my thought was 20 wins a year weren’t enough for the clean program he ran?
I hope Pitt never becomes a win-at-all cost football or basketball program. I’d rather have eight and 20-win seasons knowing there’s no cheating and the players are truly student-athletes trying their best.
Some fans complaining about a quarterback finding an open receiver amidst a heavy pass rush are the same ones who can’t find their car after the game, and that’s what it is after all, a game. To take it so seriously where we hate other schools and opposing coaches and their fans. How does that make us better? What’s that say about us?
Sorry for getting on my soapbox. Thank you for your proper perspective Mike.
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10 wins (in football) to Pitt isn’t what they want unless the program is as upright and positive as it can be. Reputation is everything. But given a choice it’s Pitt’s way or the highway no matter how many wins.
And I agree with your sentiments exactly… “Sure we’d like to see victory week-after-week. What is more important is that the players are staying out of trouble, getting a quality education and learning the merits of hard work.”
That is way more important to me than an extra few wins per year – but we can do both, many schools do just that.
I don’t feel we’ll see another National Championship again unless the stars – every single star in the skies – align but I can see conference championships and maybe a playoff. We came pretty close to being highly ranked in 2016 and it can happen again… it is all about recruiting though IMO.
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Thank you Mike for posting and sharing those pics.
Todays game is more about money for schools and the NCAA
Money drives many of the decisions.
I do agree that the experience is important. Winning is great but the memories are what connects us.
Pitt doesnt have to win championships for Pitt fans to have fun. Tailgating with friends and family, watching an entertaining game, and supporting your school are the important things.
Pitt’s in a much tougher conference now. I’m glad there is at least talk of improving facilities (Victory Heights), hiring experienced coaches, holding both coaches and athletes accountable for field and classroom performance, and building competitive programs across the board.
Sports help bring balance to a school and community. And sites like this allow the school spirit and pride to be on full display. We all see things differently and arent shy about opining, but its good to remember to be respectful and not to take things too personally. Our passion for Pitt can sometimes make us all look childish.
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Thank you Mike. Your post gives perspective and it is much appreciated. Hope to hear from you more.
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Guys – even when we snipe and insult this site is head and shoulders above any others I can find as far as real honest discussions about not only Pitt football but sometimes more personal things. That is what I envisioned and that is what you all have done to make it that way and I thank you.
That is why I don’t ban people on here (but one was not site related really) and that is why I allow “trolls” also, because when you listen to what a troll might write and respond in a respectful manner then they are contributors and can take part… and agree to disagree if they feel like it.
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Also – big article about the POV’s 2018 Golf Outing coming up soon. Mark the date – June 9th and I’ll get all the details up ASAP.
We had a truly fantastic time last year and this year will be more of the same…
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Reed, I will agree. Heated differences of opinions are to be expected if not wanted altogether on what is normally a faceless and anonymous blog. << Which the POV really isn’t. Thanks to the golf outings, round-table discussions and the great Fran tailgates with pictures. The POV is very unique in many ways but not immune to passionate discussions. I do think the sniping is pretty much limited here but will add. If I have offended anyone in the past I ask for forgiveness and will try much harder to be more considerate in the future and try not to rub it in too much when PITT kicks some serious butt.
Last thought I’ll add is that any type of PITT success in any sport seems to temper the tempers… So let’s keep that up PITT/Heather. . … ike
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Having been to SEC games at Florida and Auburn, the Pitt experience can never live up to what those places present. One item is the on site stadium, but beyond that is the geography of the campus.
Pitt stadium did not lead itself to traditions like alum gathering at the old grand fraternity houses and walking as a group to the game. Generations of fans could join in and not need oxygen to climb up to the stadium. That problem even applies to tailgating groups. It’s hard enough to park one vehicle in Oakland let alone a group. I actually think the Heinz Field setting is better than anything available on campus, but sucks compared to many of the major football schools.
The best we can hope for is competitive teams, that at least make the in stadium show enjoyable.
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Went golfing with my quipster brother in law years ago who after around 8 holes yelled out that, ike must have a girlfriend over in those woods.
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EtnaPanther — appreciate your article. And love the photo- especially the little Panther cheerleader. Most excellent!
I’ve been guilty of accepting mediocrity because I go to Pitt games and I root for Pitt even when they’re crappy. Shame on me.
But I think back to all the free entertainment I’ve gotten because I’m a Pitt fan. Plenty of pain, but plenty of fun watching my Panthers (not to mention the entertainment value of all the coaching searches!).
Go Pitt.
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After playing in the Big East, I think that many of us felt the additional resources and momentum provided through membership in the ACC would enable Pitt to close the gap between Pitt and programs like PSU and OSU. We felt the additional dollars would be used to improve football so that increased FB revenue from a successful FB program could then be used to improve the other non-revenue sports (we assumed Pitt BB could hold its own). As the years have ticked by, we have not seen this happen, mostly due to the mismanagement and musical chairs played by the ADs and head coaches.
Nordenberg became Chancellor in 1996 and Gallagher took over in 2014. So there is a tradition of stability at the top level that should have produced a much more stable coaching environment for Pitt football. Unfortunately, the record does not reflect this, and Nordenberg made the horrendous decision to bring back Pederson in 2007 after he failed at Nebraska. Cornhole was then the AD in 2011 when Pitt entered the ACC, and his return may prove to be the event that killed Pitt football for a generation.
The momentum from joining the ACC is long gone. Pitt can no longer fund raise from this move, and in fact there may be a growing group who believe that Pitt will never be able to compete against the better FB programs like Clemson and Florida State and should get out. Heather must fight against this defeatist attitude as well, as she tries to swim upstream and rebuild Pitt athletics.
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Pitt baseball won the final game vs nd this afternoon, salvaging one game in the disappointing weekend series loss to the irish.
Banman homered in the top of the ninth inning to break a 7-7 tie.
Pitt was up 7-3 after four innings and let the Irish climb back with poor pitching and silent bats until the ninth inning homer.
Pitt plays psux on Tuesday and then finishes with two tough weekend series to end the regular season vs Louisville and clemscum.
H2P!
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@Reed at 2:51pm – Almost agree that reputation is everything…..unless you are in higher education. Higher Ed is full of scandal and cheating, especially in athletics. If anyone thinks applications are down at UNC for their academic scandal, or Syracuse for theirs….or insert any other college name here, except Dairy College, that is incorrect.
This is the basic reason Pitt is in the situation they are in. They always thought reputation was so critical and that athletics could only harm the reputation, not improve it. For 40 years Pitt has been running from athletics, thinking they were smart. They were not. Other universities saw the value of escalating athletics and now thrive both academically and athletically.
If you are not on the train, you are off. Pitt has been off and Gallagher is hopefully starting to grasp that you can have both and a squeaky clean program (which we are not) is starting to be viewed differently.
I am hoping to get a couple of my students to allow me to print their investigative reporting on cheating in the P5 and its non-impact to academic standing, applications and or reputational harm.
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I actually think cheating has little to no impact on applications and overall school reputation. In fact, it probably marginally helps since if you cheat, you generally win at things.
Now scandals like Baylor, Michigan State and Penn State may be a tad bit different since felonies were committed along with child and student endangerment. But if anything, donations went up at Penn State since it gave fans and alumni something to rally around and the cult is stronger than ever.
Pitt always thought athletics was a dirty business. That sports would be the ruin of the university yet academic scandals are just as prevalent but dont get the press. Sexual harassment, fudging of numbers and degrees, misappropriation of grant money, plagiarism, etc, etc
I’m all for winning the ‘right’ way. Many strong academic schools like Stanford and Wisky are also strong across the board in sports and show a real commitment to athletics. So it can be done without sacrificing a school’s integrity and academic mission.
Gallagher talks about Pitt’s front porch but I dont know how serious he is. Show me.
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Mike, who cares if you graduated from Pitt? As long as you’re buying, I’ll be glad to sponser you for all Alumni events.
I do have a couple suggestions for you though.
First, any guy that has the sense to start at psu, accept his mistake, and redeem himself by obtaining a degree from the University of Pittsburgh is worthy to wed my daughter. But that’s just my opinion.
Second, you’re a good writer. You should post more.
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It’s funny, Pitt has put up with some real SOBs on the academic side because they were so great in their fields. I mean some not so nice people. The rep has always been professional, not personal. They do seem to be a tad hypocritical with regards to athletics.
True story about a prick prof I had . 5 days post op from gallbladder surgery( the old fashioned 10 inch scar type) he made me take his final. I still had staples in and couldn’t sit without holding a pillow against my stomach. This was in the MBA program. He checked the pillow for a crib sheet. What a tool! That btw had nothing to do with the comment prior.
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Nice write up buddy. Beautiful Family!
Upitt sliced a swing on 18 in Fort Lauderdale today right through a window. Things were good till that happened. Nice win today by baseball. Need to win at least 2 of 6 against Clemson and L’Ville.
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Was “Nothing But Window”, your golfing version of the old commercial, “Nothing But Net”?
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Another true golf story. Golfing at Cederbrook down off rt 70. Tee one up and let her rip. Slicing toward the interstate. Tried another one and same thing then waited and hoped not to hear cars crashing which we didn’t. Sure enough on the way home back up 70 there were two golf balls laying in the gutter same spot. I never did grasp the concept that you cannot get a hole in one on a 595 yard par 5.
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Me either…. Haha
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Just to make a slight clarification to my article, It was Reed (Thanks)that posted that picture of Pitt Stadium. And secondly those are 5 of my 6 Grandchildren. Jeez, if had that many young kids at my age I would be drinking constantly.
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Here’s a couple post article thoughts on Mike’s efforts today:
Isn’t it interesting to read a comment from a great PITT fan that hasn’t become overly invested in wins and losses?
How cool is it that Mike has passed on his interests in the PITT football program with no strings attached only family and fun.
When you read Mike’s next comment on the POV, will you now pause a little more and read more carefully knowing a little about who he is, what he looks like and can picture his family? Yes, I sure as hell will.. Thanks again Mike.. . . .ike
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Good read Mike. Enjoyed it. And I’d be happy if we win one ACC football title before I go to Panther Heaven. Once every 10 years would be Gravy !
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And furthermore the attacks on the Commander and posters are totally uncalled for. We do have to remember Pitt boards/blogs/sites are constantly under Troll attack since we share our turf in Pittsburgh with the boastful for no reason Pedos and the just Pitt hating Hillbillies.
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as a fellow non-alum Pitt fan, I enjoyed the article and also less hung up than most here on the W-Ls. I have thought for a while that expectations may be too high
Mike, that isn’t an NC State cheerleader costume, is it?.
Reed, how old is that photo? It must go back aways …. a lot of greenery and houses where there are now college and medical buildings, plus I don’t see a scoreboard the stadium
wwb
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1950, when Ike was 15 years old.
(Don’t really know)
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hey bro wbb….hope you are well !
Looks like the 1960’s since Trees Hall is there in the pic. Trees was built in 1962. So between then and 1970 I’d say.
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Nope not NC State but Shaler Area, she wouldn’t have been allowed in the picture
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We’ll, I’ll be glad to do an article where you all send in bios and some photos so we can all put info and faces to the comments we read of yours.
We can use first names only if you’d prefer…I’ll do a request article on that this week.
Also just for some summer planning…
When camp starts and we get a semi- solid stating lineup I’ll do another Upgrade, Downgrade or Draw series on position units.
It is fun looking back now though to see if what we felt last summer came true or not.
I also want to do a series from guest writers about their best and worse Pitt football experience.
And a series on surprise highly rated HS players who ended up busts and stars who came out of nowhere….
Any more suggestions are more than welcome.
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Joseph C. Trees, “a true Pitt man” according to the 1915 The Owl student yearbook
Trees apparently donated $100,000 for the construction of Trees Hall. He played football for Pitt in the 1890’s. Yea I said the 1890’s. He also had a huge 3000 acre Apple Orchard out in Gibsonia I use to drive thru all the time as a shortcut to Route 228.
It’s the current site of Treesdale Golf & Country Club. Which is a very nice track I’ve played. Arnold Palmer was involved with the design of the course and part owner I believe.
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That’s a Course I haven’t played yet. Thanks for the referral.
Emel – are you able to make it up to Champion Lakes near Latrobe on a June 9th for the POV Golf Outing?
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Man I would love to EE. But I’m nursing some injuries at the moment and haven’t been able to play golf or tennis this year yet. I love that area of Ligonier-Somerset. Use to play Seven Springs Golf Course a lot.
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Get well soon. Know that you’ll be missed.
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Emel, if you haven’t been in the area, 228 Route 228 has replaced McKnight Road as the commercial center of the north.
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Surely you jest. I was in that area in 2013. Route 228 is still only 2 lanes from 19 to 8. It’s not even on par with 19 in Cranberry. Who are you btw…that u post under anon ?
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Well let me break the rules right now and give Reed a good jab in his ribs as he knows we are the same age, 48, . . . ike*
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Yes, Iek. You were once 48. I think Johnny Majors was our football coach then. 🤡🤡🤡
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^^ rule breaker!! 🙂
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^^ Yes my emogi’s are as old as I am…
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^^ I mean as old as Reed is 😉
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Hey EE, my plans are to still be at the POV golf outing but not golfing. Will pay for the golf cart for Reed and I (I’ll drive) and hope to sponsor a foursome including my two sons and two of their buddies. << This depends on my two sons, who seem to be busy 24/7 these days. btw, I get that but…. that’s how it goes I guess?
Hey Annie, are you still in for the beer cart girl? Maybe EE’s wife could ride along?
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I don’t care as much about W-L as I do about being competitive and producing entertaining football games.
Of course, better teams will be more competitive and have more entertaining football games… and more Ws and less Ls.
Which is not to say I don’t care about Ws and Ls a great deal because I do. But I can have fun watching a Pitt loss and come out of it saying damn that was still a good/great game of football even though Pitt lost. I’ve done so before, I’m sure I will do so again.
It’s the “WTF… SOP” losses that drive people up a tree.
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Very nice writeup Mike. Please post more often as I’m sure others here would be interested in your thoughts on the Pitt athletic programs.—Oh, how I wish that the Pitt stadium was still around today.
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Kumbaya https://g.co/kgs/BS35kE
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Interesting article over at PSN
Most 2019 Offers By State:
Florida: 53
Ohio: 24
Georgia: 18
Pennsylvania: 17
Michigan: 16
New Jersey: 14
We have to up the offers in the Carolinas which has more talent than PA and NJ now. And also Virginia.
Also interesting that Pitt has offered a QB in SC (Darryl Blevins ?)who is related to bball recruit Trey McGowens. A 6’6″ kid who hasn’t been noticed as of yet by many, so Nard Dog and crew are in on this kid at least, before the masses.
Would that be good recruiting ?
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Interestingly we now have only two offers out to 5* recruits and about 70 4* kids for 2019. Blue chip kids get offered in their SO and JR HS years.
Last year we offered six 5* recruits and over 90 4* players (and signed one).
In 2018 we had just one 4* recruit for an official visit – Salahuddin who signed. 100% hit rate.
In 2017 we had five 4* official visits and signed three. 60% hit rate
In 2016 we had six 4* official visits and signed five. 83% hit rate
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For some Monday fun.
Bernie B. sent me an e-mail today with a link in it. It goes back to The Pitt Blather in 2013 when one of the commenters, Frankcan, was a regular on that website.
For those who don’t know who Frankcan is (or was maybe) he was a commenter with whom you never knew what was going to show up on the comment box because of the way he thought about Pitt sports and tried to put those thoughts into actual words…and he was hilarious.
We have named our POV golf outing trophy after him, it is The “FRANKCAN TROPHY” because fun and silliness is what the POV golf outing, and this blog, is all about.
http://www.pittblather.com/2013/11/30/positives-and-negatives-miami/#more-17507
(Great early comment from Dr. Tom in the thread also)
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Dr. Tom play nice please i dont think i have said any thing bad to you in 8 weeks this is my cant we be nice day ,the only one any one gets for 8 more weeks.
Comment by Frankcan 12.02.13 @ 4:41 pm
LOL…he was one of a kind.
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This is one of my favorite Frankcan quotes:
“Dan if we go to the little ceasars bowl in detroit
here is what the players get they go to a city that is colder then pittsburgh.
they get a pizza party and go bowling sounds like the birthday party i had for my son when he was 10.
then they get to get up on xmas early and feed the homeless of detroit breakfest very nice thing but not much fun.
do to the fact half of deroit is homeless not becuse they are poor.
but becuse the city was bombed out bye the germans in WW2 and never rebuilt that is my story and i am sticking to it.at least that is how it looks.
i know i am a prick but what a place to put a bowl ugh .”
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Too funny….
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Nice lead article by Mike. I remember the Steeler games at Pitt Stadium. I have a large one foot square 3 D resin model of Pitt Stadium on my shelf if they ever want to use it to rebuilt it.
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To follow on from the above: in DWs recruiting…
In 2006 we had nine 4* official visits and signed six. 66% hit rate
In 2007 we had nine 4* official visits and signed six. 66% hit rate
In 2008 we had one 5* and 10 4* official visits and signed six. 55% hit rate
In 2009 we had six 4* official visits and signed four. 66% hit rate
In 2010 we had three 4* official visits and signed three. 100% hit rate
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Quick note for all you, “The ACC is sooo much better than the Big East was.”.. You are wrong.
Here are the conference BOWL records from 1998-2015.
Pos Conference Record
1 Big West (3-0-0)–1.00000
2 Big East (46-29-0)–0.61333
3 SEC (95-60-0)–0.61290
4 MWC (42-35-0)–0.54545
5 PAC-12 (59-55-0)–0.51754
6 Big 12 (66-69-0)–0.48889
7 CUSA (43-46-0)–0.48315
8 Sun Belt (15-17-0)–0.46875
9 ACC (62-73-0)–0.45926
10 Big Ten (60-74-0)–0.44776
11 WAC (23-29-0)–0.44231
12 Independent (12-18-0)–0.40000
13 MAC (26-40-0)–0.39394
14 AAC (6-12-0)–0.33333
Additionally, the Big East appeared in 15 BCS games during the BCS era, winning 8 of those.
And before you say, “Well, the league was ‘top heavy’ then”. Wrong again.
TEN teams claimed at least a share of the Big East Championship from 1993-2012. And in the BCS games mentioned above, wins came from Miami, West Virginia and Louisville. Also representing the Big East in the BCS bowls were Pitt, Uconn, Miami, Va Tech and Syracuse.
I encourage all of you to review the bowl records of the ACC (and even the Big 10) over those years (ACC 62-73-0–0.45926; Big 10 60-74-0–0.44776) and tell me again how bad the Big East was.
I could actually write an article on the fallacy of perception regarding the BIg East but alas taking away excuses might strike some of you as “too negative.”
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The Big East was crushed by the ACC when they took Miami, Va Tech and BC. I always lament the fact that if ND would have become a full member, none of that would have happened. Also if they would have let PSU join. Big East football would have been quite formidable with those two additions.
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That’s not accurate. The Big East continued to be extremely competitive in it’s final years. From 2005-2012, the Big East had winning bowl records. The league was 27-15 .642 in bowl games and ended every season with 2-3 ranked teams– all AFTER Miami, Va Tech and BC left. I can tell you, that bowl record was better than the ACC.
While the Big East certainly wasn’t the SEC in those days, to ignore how good WVU, Rutgers, UConn, Cincy and USF were in the waning years of the Big East is simply revisionist.
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So why didn’t that translate to financial success? And why did the league collapse?
When I say the league was crushed by poaching and defections, I am not talking about success on the field. Basketball had great success too. I am talking about the demise of the conference.
Those teams all had great years for them, but it didn’t translate to success for the conference.
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And other than WVU, their success was short lived, they have all fallen on pretty hard times for various reasons.
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All of which as ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with my original argument. I was simply was pointing out to the “the ACC is so much tougher than the Big East was” crowd that their argument is complete BS.
I didn’t say they had financial success. I didn’t say they were good now. I simply stated (obviously not simply enough for some) that the FOOTBALL being played top-to-bottom in the Big East, particularly the last 5 years was not only better than some give credit but better than the ACC. That was my only point.
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I totally agree that the BE was better in ACC in FB throughout this millennium … up until 2013 when BE FB dissolved. Even after the 2003 exodus, teams like WVU (especially), Louisville, Cincy and even Rutgers (for a few years) took over and did quite well. Pat White started 4 bowl games and won all 4 … two them as underdogs in the Sugar Bowl. And this is an argument that many of us made back then on The Blather.
But what’s your point Jay91? BE FB dissolved in 2013.
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OK
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That picture is from the mid to late seventies. The Engineering building is there plus the odd building next to the parking lot next to Western Psych looks to be under construction.
Frankcan was a hoot, Reed must have cleaned up the grammar and spelling plus it is not in all caps.
I think I remember him saying he was from Franklin PA. I wonder if anyone knew his true identity.
I am still planning to attend the golf outing, but may be on the bench due to severe tennis elbow, which sucks, because the weather is finally cooperating.
Maybe I will ride with Annie, or be a Ranger and harass slow players.
I have played Treesdale, not one of my favs. More of a traditionalist and would rather play the older clubs without the McMansions lining the fairways.
Yes, 228 is a nightmare these days.
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GC. I will be attending also and not playing. We should set up beer runs in golf carts. I’d like to be the Don Rickles Ranger, laughing and criticizing players swings and calling out cheaters!
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I am still hopeful to play, but had tennis elbow once or twice before and you never know.
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At our age it is always something.
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but why no scoreboard and look to the left hand side of Presby and note the row of houses … are you sure it wasn’t before that?
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Looks like the LRDC was being built in the picture. That would mean early 70’s.
Tex
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While nostalgia is always good. We have to make the best of where we are right now.
We are in the ACC and need to learn how to compete and make new rivalries in that conference.
We play at Heinz Field and need to embrace that experience and make better memories.
A walk down memory lane is fine, but living in the past is for losers.
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From top to bottom the ACC is a far better conference than the old big east. Just look at the national titles and directors cup rankings over the years. But again, past history. But why is it relevant? Because Pitt needs to step up their game to successfully compete. Having 3 of your programs play in a 70 year old facility without AC is an embarrassment. Not having a track or tennis courts is another.
Tex
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@Jay – I like the list. In reviewing it, there seemed to be a lack of big time opponents such as Alabama, OSU, Oregon, Florida, Tenn, MSU, Dairy, against the big east during that time frame. I may not remember this correctly, but for the most part, didn’t the big east get shunned from the big bowls and our better teams played against 3rd and 4th best teams from other conferences? I might have that wrong. Maybe it’s because we just weren’t so good for most of the years you referenced and i didn’t keep track.
I like the list but again, not sure if it says a lot. I don’t think it was big east # 5 ranked team in nation going against another top 5 opponent in those games. Some may sound like they were powerhouses, but perhaps not. Good fodder however.
@gc – you can’t build a rivalry when you are 6-6, 7-5. Games just don’t mean anything. That is why Pitt does not have a rival in the ACC. If we are 9-2 going against Vtech who is also 9-2 with the winner getting to be ACC champ 3-4 years in a row, with different results, you might have something. If we are 6-5 and they are 7-4, and we are playing for second and third place of coastal, no rivalry.
Calling folks losers for living in the past is funny, yet perhaps, a bit profound. When Pitt beats the Dairy and the series goes on hiatus, does that mean we are losers every time we think back to the time when we played? I think not, but I may be in the minority. P.S. I don’t like Steeler Stadium for College Football. That whole notion is so steve peterson. I see the football team representing Pitt. Our AD saw the team in steeler stadium representing Pittsburgh. Last I saw we were a university and all its home games should be played on their respective home fields. It is steeler stadium, not Pitt. Two different mind sets.
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Agree that you can’t form a rivalry when there is little at stake. If and when we start competing for Coastal and ACC Championships, rivalries will occur naturally. It took many games and many years to develop the hatred for ND, PSU and WVU.
I am just saying losers live in the past, winners live in the now.
The mind set that Heinz Field is Steeler Stadium and not equally shared is the problem. On Saturdays it is Pitt Stadium for better or worse. Some guys prefer to look at the worse and lament about the loss of Pitt Stadium. That is the past. People that don’t embrace the now and the future are doomed to failure.
Hey I enjoy sitting around and remembering the good ole day as much as the next guy, when I wasn’t fighting the relentless pains of advanced age. You can’t live life worrying about what should have or could have happened. I am sure that Narduzzi and our players don’t waste a second thinking about an on campus stadium. They are looking forward to that next win.
Pitt Stadium is gone forever, just like Forbes Field, The Civic Arena, Three Rivers etc. They were just buildings. Steve Pedersen is gone and so is Pitt Stadium. The now and immediate future is Heinz. If Pitt is to return to greatness, or even goodness, it will be at Heinz Field. If they don’t there never will be a new Pitt (insert sponsor here) Stadium.
Those of us old enough to remember that Pitt once shared its stadiums with the Pirates and the Steelers.
I doubt that it was controversial.
So you could say that it is traditional.
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I liked the bleacher seating. The piss troughs. Lack of concessions and long lines. The walk up a steep hill. The track around the field. The scoreboard. Yes there weren’t many amenities in that 70 year old stadium but it was ours on campus.
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Congratulations to whomever decided on the name ‘FRANKCAN Trophy’ — very wise choice. If a second POV award / trophy comes to fruition, my nomination for that one would also be someone who may not be around anymore …. Reverend George (from Columbus). He always brought much needed civility to the Blather.
wwb
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wwb – Agree on the Reverend George. Always cheerful & upbeat about PITT. I miss the commentary of the Rev, George & Frankcan.
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I’ve always believed the Big East was an under-rated conference in football. I also agree with gc in thinking that if the Big East could have somehow lured Notre Dame into becoming a full-time member the conference may have become elite. That said it was doomed when Miami left and the transition into the power conferences became obvious.
The above list says that 3 of the top 4 conferences in bowl winning % combined 155 bowl games played while the SEC, the only P-5 school in the top 4, also played 155 games alone.
The ACC played in 135 bowl games while the Big East only participated in only 75 games. What does all that mean? The second tier P-5 teams get into bowl games (and lose) more than the lesser conferences. Like the Big East.
Either way I really don’t have a dog in the fight over which conferences are better top to bottom. That changes every year. . . . ..ike
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Thanks for sharing the blather link. Lots of good memories there.
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Huff, fair point. That said, the BIg East could only play who was on their schedule and they were often shunned from bigger bowls due to financial concerns (small enrollment/fans bases equals poor tv and ticket revenue)– not football related concerns. You will find that the Big East had a similar regular season OOC record over that time period- including games against ACC, SEC and Big 10 opponents.
Ike, the ACC played in 135 games compared to 75 for the Big East bust also had 50% more teams.
Regardless, my ONLY point was that there are quite a few who make excuses for Pitt’s record in Wanny’s last years by “sh1tTing” on the Big East and say that the ACC in 2017 was so much harder. I was postulating that the notion was BS, which I fully believe it to be.
Nothing more.
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Even after the first defections the Big East always got an unfair national rap. Outside of Pitt’s debacle against Utah, the Big East BCS team almost always performed well in that game. I had so many debates defending that leagues inclusion and they truly were a worthy number 6 and some years better than the ACC for sure. However the seat at the table was going away and the league management had no pull to protect the schools, Pitt was right to jump no question. That said the bowl records are skewed as someone mentioned above the bowl tie ins were not good and outside the BCS it was mostly MAC teams or something silly like Big East #2 vs SEC #8 when they played a power conference. I agree with your point but the bowl records are not convincing to the outside eyes.
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Reed and BigB, thanks for the Blather post, made me shed a tear it was so funny.
Frankcan was a classic and should be the first inductee to the Blather HOF.
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+1
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Kind of sad that so few comment on Pitt Blather anymore.
Reed have you extended an invitation to Chas to write the BBall articles here?
He is obviously too busy to keep his site busy, but still writes some great stuff when he is so inclined.
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Jay, I with you 1000% on the silly Wanny bashing. Biggest mistake PITT made in many a moon firing Dave. I’m not one of those that bash that league, just the opposite in fact. ike
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I read the Blather sometimes but we keep our blogs at a respectful but friendly distance. Once I left the blather it really fell upon Chaz to do all the writing and he’s not retired. He is a full-time father and full-time lawyer and has a lot of other things going on so the blather truly was a hobby to him… and that’s why you don’t see the amount of articles that there was before.
But he’s a great writer and whenever I want to read anything about Pitt basketball I go over there and read his stuff
he’s really very good and we’re still friends.
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Ike, I respect the pro-Wanny Pitt fans, I liked Coach W and felt he was a solid overall recruiter and a passionately loyal Pitt guy with a national rep that attracted attention. That said, much like Coach Dixon, when he left I felt like it was the right time for him to move on. IMHO DW was a below average game day coach, struggled as a disciplinarian, and his recruiting success seemed lopsided toward the defensive front 7 (of the first 2 I’m confident about, the third is just a recollection). I don’t feel you need to be pro-Wanny or anti-Wanny, just appreciate the guy and move on. I do wonder if he’d be a perfect (not necessarily realistic) fit as Narduzzi’s DC, where he could just manage under PN’s direction and add much needed recruiting punch; he’s also the right age for a PN assistant hire.
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Pitt soccer just received a commitment from Athalie Polomo … just hope his talent measures up to his name.
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The next time Pitt has a HC that wins 19 games in 2 years….awaken me. Until then DW is a genius in my book.
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The next time we exit the ACC, join the old Big East and add cupcake non conference games back to our schedule, awaken me as well…
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What we haven’t played cupcake games every year since and before ?
The non-con in 2008 included; Navy, Notre Dame, Iowa, Buffalo and BGSU
Last year the non-con was : Pedo St. Okie St, Rice & YSU (pretty much a wash there)
The non-con in 2009 included; Navy, Buffalo, Notre Dame, NC State (Russell Wilson) and YSU
The non-con in 2013 was : Navy, New Mexico, Notre Dame and Old Dominion (1 more tougher game in 2009)
The non-con in 2014(which was a 6 win season) included: Delaware, Florida International, Iowa & Akron
The non-con in 2012 (which was another 6 win season) was: Gardner-(Del)Webb, Buffalo, NotreDame & Youngstown State. (very lame non-con, but still only won 6 games under PC)
So the non-con in those years that netted 19 wins in 2 years was not any softer and you might say they were tougher than many non-con schedules in the years since.
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On the great pic at the Top of this article and again saddens me we have no Pitt Stadium any longer.
We know it’s after 1962 since Trees Hall is there and it’s probably before 1974. However there are some cars parked along some of the streets. If anyone has a one of enlarging the pic or has a magnifying glass, perhaps they could recognize some model years of the cars.
The scoreboard must have been removed or maybe it was in the middle of being replaced. Perhaps they replaced the scoreboard when the Majors Era started. That would seem to make sense.
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Mike,
A belated thanks for your post and I greatly appreciate and share your sentiments. Hope to meet you at a POV tailgate someday.
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Is that a squirrel drinking a beer ? lmao 🙂
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A Guiness!
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Observation after perusing the non-cons for the couple above post.
37% of PC’s wins (19) were against these schlubs;
Gardner-(Del)Webb (D2)
Buffalo
New Mexico
Old Dominion (D2)
BGSU
Delaware (D2)
Florida International
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Albany this year
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He was a poor game day coach and couldn’t recruit. But he’s tearing things up at whisky now. Go figure.
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Pitt’s LRDC Building is under construction in the picture.
Construction started in 1972, so picture is circa 1973.
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Agree. Completed in 74. Looks like 73 to me
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Yep I agree also, it’s right before Majors came or was coming. As PITT is still in block letters in the Far endzone. The Major Change to Pitt script hadn’t happened yet. Scoreboard missing cause it was being replaced.
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Never could hook up with Reverend George in cbus. I asked several times if he wanted to meet as I was new to columbus back then, had free time and offered to buy him food and his favorite manishevitz as I knew he was older. He never took me up on the offer and it bums me out that he no longer is with us…or just changed monikers! Do we know anything about him?
The POV Ring of Giabroney’s makes some sense to honor those that have made us think, which in and of itself is an amazing accomplishment.
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I think Rev George got miffed over the debate on Russell Shell and was never heard from again.
Obviously the guy believed in second chances but never gave us one. Ironic.
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He is no longer with me us.
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Has the reverend gone to the larger pasture in the sky or just not been around here?
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OT, PSN going primarily paid.
Question: if someone pays for their info I assume I can forward the info as long as I don’t copy and paste verbatim. iekster.
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What we see at Whisky is the effects of a good, solid program where everyone is on the same page. This can overcome some minor deficiencies in on-field coaching and recruiting. Let’s hope that we now have a Chancellor, BoT, Athletic Director, donors, alums and coaching staff at Pitt that are all finally on the same page going forward.
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Sorry, that was VOR above. Blew out the cookies and lost the moniker as well.
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You’ve recovered your Voice nicely and within reason…
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gc… join the golf outing that EE is setting up in June… win it and your name along with your teammates will be engraved on the “ FRANKCAN” Cup for eternity….
He was a special fellow who was passionate about his Panthers. I was just a reader and not a poster when FRANKCAN was active and I would tune in multiple times a day to see what our eloquent , grammatically correct Reed and his antithesis FRANKCAN would expound upon……Truly missed and not forgotten
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Wonder if Joe D is still kicking… he gave Dokish and Chaz fits….
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I liked his stuff…pecan pies & track times, lol.
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Is anyone else concerned that there have been so few FB recruits announced so far? I guess we will see a few announcements over the summer when the camps are underway.
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June is a big recruiting month for Pitt. UCLA, Syracuse and Pitt are the only P5 schools with zero recruits so far in 2018.
Yeah, I’m concerned…
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What % of early commits really stick though. Its still early. I’m sure Pitt will land their usual 15-20 when the dust settles. But, I would think a barely 5 win season has something to do with it along with 35k average fans (thats the number I got from Pitt)…so its probably even less than that. 40k yellow seats look terrible on TV and when recruits visit. OCS…OCS…OCS
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I’m trying to remember and sorry if I’m wrong but wasn’t the two star TE from the northeast one of the first to commit last year? He later de-committed and left for UCLA. I remain calm and don’t make it a habit of looking for trouble. It comes to me naturally….. ikester…
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Check that. I think Stanford.
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It better be all hands on deck this recruiting season to come away with at least a reasonable class. I just don’t like how this program is trending right now. Even if Pitt wins 8 games this year, I’m not sure that is good enough to bring in a top class for next year. Pitt is coming off a mediocre recruiting class now, and I’m not sure how things are going to improve unless the new assist coaches really start to produce.
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In honor of the first Pitt HOF class, let me nominate my first POV HOF class..
Emel
UPitt
Erie Express
JoeL
… and of course..
Commander Reed
I have a Hall of Shame list, too. But, I’ll keep that to myself.
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ike should be on this list.
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Voice of reason, Ike is but not on the first list. Jay92
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Chas has been commenting fairly regularly. He tends to go MIA in the summers and during some dead periods. I’m guessing we have a late May to sometime in camp hiatus approaching.
He had a crippling bout of writers block just as Reed was leaving to start this site but eventually made it back and is only in semi-retirement … He now only posts when he has something to say.
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posting, not commenting
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Carr commits to Minnesota…..Gannon must have said no. Enjoy the bench you one handed brick shooter! Another schoolie open for Capel to get us a real D1 basketball player.
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Geez, a little bitter, LOL.
Hope the kid does well. Not his fault he played for Stallings.
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Just saw PSN has a pay site called Die Hards…haha. I vote Iek and Big B as HOF material.
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I meant in addition to Jays illustrious group above…
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The basketball roster is
If Ellison leaves, Pitt is left with Davis, McGowan and Aiken at guard. A sophomore and two freshman. One of which is a walk on.
Not a recipe for success. When is the cut off for signing players for this coming year?
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Hey Big Dan, want to call the bet off now?
The basketball roster isn’t close to being set just yet.
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Ike, if a website is for pay then you can link to it… but I don’t cut and paste very much at all, maybe a few sentences or a paragraph.
But I do that because they can get more hits through my blog that way. It acts as a teaser and ups their traffic.
If I was just a reader and a commenter I wouldn’t cut and paste anything out of a pay site because that’s breaking the terms of their agreement with you…or at least make sure whatever you do includs a link to the paysite.
Very few free Pitt sports blogs left I guess…here, The Blather and Dokish I guess.
We’ll, I’ll close the site down or give it to someone before I charge a subscription. The whole point here is to enjoy for free.
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Not blowing smoke but there is nothing as good or better than the POV that’s for sure.
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Ellison was recruited over at St. Johns and was part of the hype machine Stallings had in motion while trying to secure an extra year at Pitt. If you look at last season’s roster, “best on the team” doesn’t really mean much and can be taken with a grain of salt.
All these kids were “invited” back but I’m sure Capel laid down the reality of the situation … “You can come back, but … you may be recruited over … you may be a role player … you may have to sacrifice minutes”.
I’m fine with Ellison taking his time. Maybe he finds a better spot. Maybe he goes pro (G-League/Overseas). Maybe he decides being a role player at Pitt is okay too. Capel has so many roster spots, he can be patient. I doubt Ellison being in limbo is affecting his recruiting much. Especially, if he doesn’t see him as a starter in the ACC. There’s a good chance, Capel keeps an open roster spot to get one more kid next season too so that makes Ellison’s decision even less pressing. Ellison is in a win-win situation. If he can’t find anything better, he has a spot at Pitt. If he does find a better spot, good for him.
MN is an odd choice for Carr since Pitino is simultaneously on the hot seat and in a position to grab a better job. Longevity can’t be the selling point. Make no mistake, it would have been nice having Carr back but he wasn’t an elite athlete. Even Xavier Johnson, despite being lower ranked, looks more like the type of athlete you need in the ACC.
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Carr is a Canuck and I noticed that his final choices were schools close to the border (MN, Marquette and MIN)
wwb
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make that MIN. Marquette and Mich
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Ellison can still help this team. Even if he was recruited over at St. Johns, he has had another year of growth, practice, weight room, etc. while sitting out, and Capel cannot afford to have his entire team filled with Freshmen. A couple of Juniors and a couple of Senior transfers would fill out the roster, and leave him with a good mix of players with 2-3 scholarships coming open each year.
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Looking ahead …. can this be Heather’s successor some years down the road?
http://cyclones.com/news/2018/5/7/athletics-small-named-senior-associate-ad-for-student-services.aspx
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if you remember, Small was a crowd favorite because he was .. small. He was a walk-on and now he is a Dr and continues to move up the ranks. Good for him
wwb
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That post by “Jay92” isn’t from me. Lest anyone think otherwise.
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VoR – Ellison, of course, can help but we don’t know if he’s an ACC caliber starter. The bigger point is that Capel has time and his decision, yay or nay, probably won’t affect what Capel and his staff are doing right now. If he comes back, great. If not, I doubt it affects the team much next season. To be honest, next season really doesn’t matter anyways. I’m not sure much can be salvaged.
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we need bodies and bodies with D1 experience for next year. Ellison would be welcome in my book. I would not be surprised to see Capel “Narduzzi it” and bring in a JUCO and or grad transfer for next year.
wwb
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I agree with you both, we need bodies (D1 experience is only one attribute, D1 caliber ability is more important), and I’d welcome Ellison next year. That said, the importance of who stays depends on what Capel can add to the roster. Why Ellison would want to sit out a 2nd straight year is beyond me anyway, and I don’t know his situation, but this reeks of him being fed bad advice; keep in mind, this is a guy who transferred to Pitt to play for Stallings, so who knows what he’s being told…
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Whew! For a moment there, I thought when you typed “Narduzzi it”, you meant win five games!
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Pitt cannot afford another o fer in the ACC BB schedule this year. They need to put a BB team out there that at least is somewhat competitive while Capel rebuilds the program. Tossing, we heard that he was the best player at Pitt last year, and while he may not be a top ACC talent he can probably help for a year or two while the future roster is developed.
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R.I.P FRANKCAN!!! I nearly split my gut reading his post about the Little Caesar’s Bowl. Hysterical. Notably, he must have spell checked that one, although as always his sentence structure was mangled.
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VoR – They will be very bad this season and it’s pretty much out of everyone’s control.
The difference is that with Capel, we can see a light at the end of the tunnel. The light at the end of the tunnel with Stallings was about 5 conference wins. Capel can bring much more much quicker … just not next season.
If you’re expecting a very competitive team, I’m afraid you will be very disappointed. It’s just the reality of the situation.
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Tossing, I tend to agree with your comments above, although if we landed a second high caliber recruit (to add in with McGowens) and he was able to reclassify as well, then I could see us surprising a few teams…
By the way, does anyone know why Xavier Johnson hasn’t signed yet?
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In true ike fashion I’m predicting the PITT mens basketball team’s upcoming season will be a great success. The question then asked is, what constitutes a great success? My answer is simple, A great success is anything greater than expected.
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Amen, ike. I would like to see a team on the court that, while not winning many games, has many high skilled but inexperienced players on the roster that give us hope for the future.
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The success (improvement over zero ACC wins) or lack of success next year is all on Capel. It is not out of everyone’s control.
Just like this past year was on Stallings, whether he lost the entire roster from his first year or not.
He has roster spots to fill and he needs to fill them with capable players. Grad transfers, JC, reclassifications, etc.
Hell, give me 5 ACC wins and a good recruiting class. Zero ACC wins is not acceptable.
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Not getting blown out
Not scoring seven points in the first half
Seeing an entertaining team
Seeing players improve
Getting one ACC win
Having hope for future
That’s success
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How about having a HC that really cares about winning and building a program. And it’s not just lip service. He’s actually moving to Pittsburgh with his family.
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^^ Well guys, after reading your criteria I can say with most certainty that this year in basketball will be a great success…
… and while you guys got me on a roll. I’m upping PITT’s football record for this season from 6-6 to 7-5 with a definite upswing in momentum! ike
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Tex, that’s a pretty good just-for-fun list. Other areas of improvement that I think are realistic: seeing your team improve throughout the year, having your coach represent the university well, and a little rebounding would be nice.
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How about the HC stay awake in the gym while on a recruiting visit?
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NRS
May 8, 2018 at 8:07 am
The basketball roster is
If Ellison leaves, Pitt is left with Davis, McGowan and Aiken at guard. A sophomore and two freshman. One of which is a walk on.
Not a recipe for success. When is the cut off for signing players for this coming year?
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Thanks
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Check out the picture from this morning in NYC at a Pitt fund raising breakfast –
https://mobile.twitter.com/Pitt_PC/status/993844981222735872/photo/1?tfw_creator=PghSportsNow&tfw_site=pghsportsnow&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fpittsburghsportsnow.com%2F2018%2F05%2F08%2Fpsn-recruiting-notebook-may-8%2F
Is that Grant Hill standing next to Charles Smith?
H2P!
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It certainly is EE…..who’s the blondie in the middle ?
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So Capel has a transfer target visiting Friday I see?
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Yep data on Milligan….so JC has almost 5 months to sign some more players for 2018-19 season
Offer
Pittsburgh
Enrolled 9/3/2015
Jonathan Milligan(JUCO)
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Some timely news … Ellison is coming back. Just announced.
1618mt – I agree. If, say, Zion Williamson commits to Pitt then it absolutely changes things. I really don’t think there are many big fish left, even the ones who may reclassify.
Expect the worst, hope for the best … that’s where I am right now with next season. But I’m expecting the best after that 🙂
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Great news…
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Ike, that TE was 3* Matt Alamio from NJ. I thought he was one of the better recruits but those UCLA girls were too much of a draw I guess…
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LOL Reed, you can’t argue Matt’s preferences for woman or weather. but no, I was referring to 2* Jay Seymour or something close to that. PITT lost two TE’s to the west coast last year.
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Maybe Jay Symond? ^^
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https://pittsburghsportsnow.com/2017/02/23/pitt-offers-tight-end-jay-symonds/
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JC probably met with Ellison while he was in NYC and that was that. Good closer. Pitt hasn’t had a real good/great one since way back when….Greenburg and Cal days
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MissingWlat…..reading FRANKCAN’s posts always came so easily and naturally for me. Is that somethingI shudbe concered wth
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U shud bee very cuncurned.
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So you too had the FRANKCAN cipher code book !
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From the above comments, you guys are setting a pretty low bar for success next season, but I’m right there with you. I could never understand why Stallings couldn’t at least teach rebounding. Those players last year were pretty weak on fundamentals.
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The Pitt basketball team will win more ACC games than the Pitt football team. You’e been told.
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Wow, that is bold TX. But damn I like that moxie!! So Capel’s team will win more than 8 games? A whole lot of people will be happy if those two win totals occur.
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VoR. don’t know if Stallings could teach rebounding it looked like he forbade it.
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^^ So what are you really saying Tx? Is it that the basketball team is going to win at least 12 games next year?
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Sorry Ike, I didn’t see your response to TX before I sent mine.
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Pitt football 6-6 record, but gets an invite to a crappy bowel game in Detroit
4 ACC wins
Pitt basketball 5 ACC wins
Overall wins at 15
Much easier to fix a basketball problem than a football problem
Pitt will average 10k in basketball, 80% capacity
Pitt will average 35k in football, 50% capacity
Basketball is on the right track…finally
Football has some problems…real problems
I own a Tardis.
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General Pickett is going to have to be another flinger on the order of AVP to get us to 6 wins.
Unless the Defense is circa Michigan State 2011 or 2012. And even then……
2012 MSU season might be of some interest. Spartan defense was 9th in Points Allowed at only 16.3 ppg. But they only finished 7-6 because the offense was horrid, only scoring 20ppg
which was 110th of 124 teams.
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PITT will average more than 35,000 next year but who can believe the numbers reported?
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Pitt football should be back to 8+ wins and the basketball team should be slightly better than last season. I think 4 ACC wins is about the max, however, in b-ball. In football, There are no sure losses. Penn State, ND, UCF and Miami are all difficult but beatable. I think they go 2-2 there and at least 6-2 against the rest of the schedule.
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Very optimistic on football, Tossing. I think they can do better than 4 ACC wins in basketball. There could still be a couple of Senior transfers in addition to Ellison coming back.
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How did the players get thru HS bball and AAU without knowing how to positions themselves to rebound ?
Or is coaching that bad at those levels anymore ?
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positions….lol….that was almost as funny….as internets, a few years back.
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VoR – Not sure how 8 wins is optimistic. Basketball is based on current roster and subject to change. Haha.
Why so down on football? The defense started turning a corner last season and the offense should be better. Don’t let a dumb spring game with mixed rosters influence you too much. They didn’t have like their top 5 wr’s in the game either.
Penn State lost their OC and several key contributors. Pitt historically plays ND tough. UCF has 100% turnover in their coaching staff and UM doesn’t have a QB.
2-2 is hardly unrealistic.
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The problem is that both Pedo State and ND has vastly superior 2 deeps compared to us. Their rosters are littered with 4 star and in ND’s case 5 star recruits. Pitt has a couple.
Pitt btw is 21 wins and 47 losses again ND historically. 30% winning %
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Baseball dumps PSU 3-2, clinching a winning record for the first time since 2013
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Was quickly perusing the other ACC team’s non-cons. Pitt has the hardest non-con of any ACC team. The rest of them (13 teams) all have at least 2 cupcake rent-a-wins of the 4 non-con game. And some of them even have 3 rent-a-wins of the 4 games. Pitt has only 1 cupcake rent-a-win.
Our schedule maker must be related to the Marquis de Sade
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Haven’t seen upitt lately. Did he defect to Estonia ? Or was it Latvia.
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of course you haven’t …. wait until the women’s softball team and men’s baseball teams bow out of the ACC playoffs, then he will have reason to post
wwb
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UPitt chimed in last week and mentioned he would have time to play in the POV golf outing on June 9th at Champion Lakes. Looking forward to meeting the young lad. I’ll assume he is either on vacation in Estonia or working hard for his Estonia bride.
Good to see the baseball team come from behind in the late innings to beat psux. The not so good was that there were only 800 people in attendance. Anytime you beat the nits in anything, that’s a good day.
H2P!
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Glad Ellison is staying. He has experience playing in a major conference.
Just a thought, did Chukwuka screw the pooch asking for his release. I have no idea if Capel is asking him back, I assume he is out of good faith. It is possible Capel does not want or need him back. He showed nothing last year. I doubt he is wanted by any team in a major conference like Carr was.
Ilegomah and George were smart and did not ask for their release, maybe realizing that getting on any ACC team is a freaking gift.
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Agree that Chukwuka showed very little, except for launching a 3-pointer every chance he got. Did you know that he was 9 for 47 on 3-pointers last year? He was a little better on 2-pointers; 27-76. He averaged 2.7 reb per game.
George showed very little; he should transfer to IUP.
Peace is the guy that intrigues me. Yes, he is very raw but also very athletic … and he just looks like he is always hustling. I would love to see Capel get a decent tall JUCO or grad transfer, and redshirt Peace this year like, under normal circumstances, he should have done last year
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Agree, Chukwuka looked like very raw talent who should have redshirted, even on that team. Same with Ilegomah and George. But with poor coaching and a poor system, hard to say if any of them will or won’t develop. Ilegomah at least is tall but like Brown needs to eat and get stronger. Maybe bring in Blair, McGhee and a few others in to toughen them up.
Have never seen an offense designed to shoot and run, without any attempt at offensive rebounding. Hope to never see it again.
Interested to see what Wilson-Frames role will be with the new coach. He should be a good rebounder with his frame. No more freelancing!
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Did Stevenson stay or go? He should also be another good rebounder.
With the two new guards, if Capel can score a scoring wingman and a couple decent senior transfers, who knows? Good coaching, especially on defense could help. Offensive rebounding may also stop those long offensive droughts.
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Maybe Narduzzi could get Capel to loan him Wilson-Frame and Stevenson to play tight end, they have the size and the hands.
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as soon as Capel was announced, both Wilson-Frame and Stevenson said they were staying. Right now I believe the roster is
Jared Wilson-Frame
Malik Ellison
Terrell Brown
Shamiel Stevenson
Kham Davis
Peace Ilegomah
Trey McGowens
Xavier Johnson
Curtis Aiken Jr (non-preferred walk-on)
not sure about George
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wwb
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Went to Volcano National Park two years ago. Just a little activity at the bottom of the Caldera then.
Amazing to see what is happening now. Tough on the people losing their houses. The risk you take to live in paradise.
Remember the game we played there that was halted at half time because the court was like an ice rink due to condensation.
Love Hawaii.
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was on Oahu for 5 days in late March ’79. Consistent weather … 80 deg, no humidity and a 10 minute rain shower about 10 am everyday. It was very hard to leave.
Did you ever go to the Punch Bowl? It is an extinct crater towards the middle of the Island that served as a cemetary for US soldiers in WWII and (I think Korea). There is a Ring of Honor there of about 10 servicemen who performed extraordinary brave acts before dying. Just like hearing the live radio accounts when visiting the USS Arizona Memorial, it is very sobering.
wwb
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Clarification after reading — the cemetery is for all US servicemen, not just soldiers. And it is not in the middle of the island but towards the middle from Waikiki where we were staying. I believe it like a northern suburb of Honolulu. Regardless, I would recommend it.
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It appears that the new assist BB coaches will be a definite upgrade over previous years. These assist coaches have head coaching experience and should be able to develop younger players better with more of an emphasis on fundamentals. I never saw a team with worse fundamentals than last year, especially in the rebounding area. Last year, the season was going so poorly that no player should have been red shirted. This year may be different as Capel focuses on rebuilding the program.
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gc, that PITT basketball game was against Gonzaga on a ship. I think PITT had the lead at halftime over a highly ranked Zags team… ike
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The game against Gonzaga that was called at halftime wasn’t played on a ship nor was it played on Hawaii (island location of Volcanoes NP). It was played in a gym on Okinawa that wasn’t air conditioned.
Gonzaga was unranked by the middle of January and wasn’t ranked again until the final poll. They weren’t a particularly good team as it turns out.
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Chukwuka is most likely waiting to see if the transfer rules change. Knowing that Pitt has 4 spots open and a need for bigs it’s probably not a pressing matter. I’m guessing he’s deciding between Pitt and a smaller school but would prefer not to sit out. Emphasis on “guessing”. Ellison was considering Villanova but waiting to hear on the transfer rules. Villanova recruited over him while he was waiting … http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article210692279.html … That kind of forced his hand coming back to Pitt.
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It is too bad Luther left, His rebounding will be missed, especially if he could stay healthy.
Plus he paid his dues and would have received recognition on Senior Day.
Hopefully Capel gets a better senior transfer.
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gc – I agree it would be nice if Luther stayed but, to be honest, we have no idea how good he actually is. He was injured and missed conference play the last two seasons. He was averaging 12 and 10 before the injury, in the non-con, and those number would have most likely gone down in ACC play. He was also in a best player on a bad team situation. I tend to think he would have struggled with fouls against more athletic players in the ACC. A guy like Luther, on a good team, should be your 7th man … not your best player.
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Good point, but we are not going to be a good team for at least a little while.
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Agree that 8 wins (football) is pretty optimistic.
I think like last year, there are too many unknowns to be sure of any prediction.
Young QB and new offensive line being the real questions. What is the upside vs the down?
How good will the defense really be?
How strong is the opposition?
Makes for an interesting year.
Here is a question, Does the football or basketball team get more ACC wins this year?
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At least there are fewer unknowns than last year, when we were counting on transfers and younger guys.
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Emel, I have been preaching to myself on here and the Blather for years about our AD and their inability to support a program through strategic scheduling. You don’t need to just look at the ACC and see three cupcakes and one coin toss game (typically). Look at last year’s top10 final rankings. Why do all the other AD’s understand how to play the game, but ours seem to think they are smarter?
That includes our current AD as far as scheduling. Look, Michigan just canceled a P5 OOC game for next year because they didn’t want to have Vtech and another P5 good team (Washington) on their schedule. The right schedule helps confidence, which helps winning, which helps recruiting. Our AD’s should not worry about the quality of opponent right now. We have a 35,000 fan base that will show up whether we play vtech or the little sisters of the poor. Use the OOC to gain confidence and prepare for the ACC schedule which is what you want to rely upon for strength of schedule ratings.
This topic ties in perfectly with the thoughts of our writer of the original thread. He is making memories going to the game. Those fans will be there regardless of who we play. It is helpful if they are wins as noted above for confidence, w-l record, recruiting, national exposure. Not one media outlet questioned the Dairy college schedule last year as they ripped thru their ooc schedule. It was weak at best.
If you work the schedule correctly as alabama and others do, you only require your team to have to be on their game 3-4 times per year. If they win 3 of 4, they are set. It is not difficult to understand.
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I have said the same thing, and guys always say they want better games. I prefer wins.
The ACC is tough enough with one game vs PSU or WVU to increase attendance.
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Concur Huff….Pitt’s non-con is insane. Last year for example on back to back to back weeks,
Creepy Valley State, Okie State (pass happy flying circus) to the run oriented option of GT.
2 Top 10 teams and then an oddball offensive scheme.
No wonder it led to 3 straight defeats and pretty much wrecked the season
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gc – I think the basketball team has more wins. Last year I wasn’t so sure. I think the basketball team could win about 4 ACC games next year. Law of averages says they’ll win a few, anyways.
Regarding football, it’s very early, but the third year is a traditional dip year for coaches with the 4th year being a rebound year. Lot’s of unknowns only because of inexperience. But the defense looked better and has depth finally. We also found our QB so we’ll have a little “it” factor in the huddle which can energize an entire team. College football is about momentum. College athletics in general, actually.
Lot’s to look forward to next season. I get the apprehension but we’ll finally get to see what Duzz had envisioned for this team. Good or bad, we’ll get some answers.
Emel had a good point about the depth of ND and PSU … Next season (2019) Pitt should have depth across the board. They have a semblance of depth on defense right now but there is still a hole on offense at some spots. We’re getting closer, however. For all the complaining about recruiting, one thing I don’t think is up for much dispute is that Duzz has had a very balanced approach to it.
As many unknowns Pitt has, so do their opponents.
Albany – Pitt win
PSU – PSU lean but a home game and maybe a revenge factor plus a new OC and replacing several skill position players
GT – flip of a coin
UNC – Pitt should be favored
UCF – Had 100% coaching turnover and are bound to come back to earth
CUSE – Pitt should be favored
ND – New QB and running back and a team Pitt traditional plays “up” to. Questions at LB, which should help a running oriented Pitt team
UVA – Pitt should be favored
VT – lean VT but closer than you think
Wake – Pitt should be favored
UM – Miami lean but Rosier is still considered the starter at QB so you never know
I don’t think it’s out of the question to split the non-con and go 6-2 in the ACC. I’m also assuming progress from last season. If not, Duzz’s seat will start warming (Finally, for some of you).
With anything in sports, luck will play a factor too. Hopefully, we have the ball roll our way a little more this season.
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Or… Here’s MY “way too early” prediction:
Albany – Pitt win, but again too close for an FCS opponent. W;
PSU – We are going to get HAMMERED! And I’m not just talking about my friends and I in the parking lot. L;
GT – Flip of a coin but I’ll be optimistic. W;
UNC – Pitt should be favored– but who cares? Aren’t we always? Pitt has lost FIVE straight to UNC. L;
UCF – UCF didn’t lose a game last year and returns almost their entire OL, along with all 2-deep at QB, TB and WR and new “air raid” coach in Heupel (we all know how well Pitt defends spread passing teams). And they change defensive fronts under new DC Randy Shannon (his defenses at Miami were pretty good.) I’m rooting for us but… L;
CUSE – Pitt should be favored and should win. W;
ND – Pitt has won 2 times at ND in the last 30 years (I’ve been to each of the last three at ND– and probably going again this year.) Game stays close but something bad happens late. L;
UVA – Pitt should be favored and BETTER win. W;
VT – Better talent usually wins.Damn, I hate the Hokies. L;
Wake – Pitt should be favored and BETTER win. W;
UM – Our ONLY chance is if it’s “old school Pittsburgh” cold and our ground game can produce– neither is likely. L
So, another 5-7 season and no bowl. Wouldn’t that really help our already spectacular recruiting. Anybody else interested in dressing up as a “yellow seat” for Halloween?
But hey! Remember, it’s not about wins and losses, it’s about spending time with family and friends in the parking lot. Wait! That’s what us students told ourselves in the ’90s when we had to sit through Hackett and Majors II.
Hope and Denial.. they’re a Pitt fan’s mushrooms and heroin. The first makes you see things that aren’t there. The other kills the pain and removes you from reality.
Pitt- we’re not your father’s softball school!
LOL
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Oops! I forgot this year’s game is in Miami. Definitely won’t be cold. Definitely won’t win.
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Maybe they can bring Voytik in as a ‘Guest QB’. Only Pitt QB to win in Miami since Freddy Mazurek, going way back to JFK days.
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I received an email from 247 listing the top 5 run stopping line-backers in the ACC according to last years statistics in conjunction with film grading expert “Pro football Focus”
#2 Saleem Brightwell
#4 Oluwaseun Idowu
Something to think about… ike
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that’s likely also a positive for the DL
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On a defense that gave up 142 rushing yards per game… But better than last year’s
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Huff… I have come around to your logic on the OOC schedule… chalk up 1 convert !
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We need wins !
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Ease up on the schedule until the football gains better players along with ins then slowly convert schedule accordingly. Huff has always been the #1 proponent.
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^^ I would agree mr anonymous but one thing. Those two are rated in that high in the category because of last years statistics. hmm? Could Reed be wrong about Shane Roy and the Narduzzi D-Line recruits? Stay tuned…
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On a defense that gave up 142 rushing yards per game… But better than last year’s.
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Forgive my frankcan writing. I suck…
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If things don’t go well for PITT they could easily end up at 5-7 again or even worse. Here’s the thing about that. So could many many teams. Yes things need to go right and not wrong for most of the college football teams in America playing each season. That’s why they play the games.
What’s interesting is that the football is oblong, you know so it bounces in funny ways. It can help win a game one week and cause a team to lose a game the next. But that’s not what’s interesting. The ball is shaped that way to be thrown which all of football never realized until the AFL came around. Football is in a constant change most of the time. Unless you pay the players or look away at major indiscretions and criminal acts to win. << Then it is static.
Bottom line for me is, Narduzzi is slowly putting all the pieces of the puzzle into place. Yep, he isn’t getting 5* players and only one 4* in last years class but the depth he’s building and the solid 3* players will show benefit as they take steps forward after years of mis-stepping and the sabotaging of the previous administration. Years of self destruction can’t be cured in overnight. This year though, will be the year where the polish will begin to shine through. And yes……. strictly imo. ike
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Jay91 – I understand the pessimism but I also think you just expect the worst. I’m curious how much better talent you think VT has. Keep in mind, I’m looking at their recruiting rankings from 2014-17 as well as Pitt’s. VT does have an advantage but they’ve had an average recruiting ranking of about 33.
You’re right, Pitt could be 5-7 again. That’s kind of my point, however. The margin between winning some games and losing some isn’t much. Pitt could easily be either 5-7 or 8-4 depending on how the ball bounces. Pitt has beaten two top 5 teams consecutive years and they’ve shown they can compete with anyone (at times).
Penn State, ND and Miami are the only teams that have a significant advantage from a recruiting and depth standpoint. All have their own issues, however, and are not unbeatable.
Win 2 games out of PSU, ND, UCF, UM and VT and Pitt can still afford one more loss against the rest of the schedule for 8 wins. It’s not easy but not unrealistic either.
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Here’s the thing.. if you’ve been watching Pitt football with any regularity, you should expect the worst. That said, it’s not pessimism.
COULD Pitt win 7 games? Sure. Could they win 3? Sure. And based on THIRTY+ years of history, I know Pitt will win some they should win and lose some they should lose.
I would be ECSTATIC if Pitt wins 8 games. Hell, I’ll buy you any bottle of booze you’d like ($75 or under, I’m no billionaire) if it happens.
You’re right, as is ike above, that any team has the potential for a 2-3 swing based on injuries, match ups, luck, etc. But the baseline for every team is VERY different.
Example: Could Alabama be 12-0 this season? Sure. Could they be 9-3? Sure. So any reasonable prediction based on returning players, recruits, schedule, etc. says anywhere between 9-12 regular season wins.
But Pitt???? The team, that has won 9+ games THREE TIMES IN 35 YEARS (and only 8+ 10 times)? Well gentlemen, 8 wins is an OUTSTANDING season in Oakland, er Heinz. And all I hear on here is how much more difficult a league the ACC is. So, if we win less than 8 games OVER 70% and have done so with better ranked recruits and a “weaker schedule”, please explain how we do it with a new OL, inconsistent TB, one (semi)proven WR no TE’s and an “improved” defense that was ranked 69th in the country last year when we have the 5th toughest schedule in the country?????
Honestly?! There’s optimism and then there’s silliness.
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Much more important to use a relevant recent database that limits extraneous variables, ie., Coach Narduzzi’s three year record. That is 21 wins, 17 loses. Which includes three big wins against arch rival penn state, eventual national champs Clemson & undefeated 2nd ranked Miami.
The wins this season come as follows Albany, penn state, GT, UNC, UCF, Syracuse, Duke, Virginia & Wake Forest.
A win in a minor bowl game gives us a little wiggle room to produce Narduzzi’s third 8-5 season even if one of these games turns up as a loss.
Not silly, just holding Narduzzi’s feet to the fire in year four of his tenure. If he’s going to produce a winner 2018 is here for him to do it. 8 wins minmum to satisfy that criteria.
Hail to Pitt!
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FWIW, as of today, I agree a bit more with Jay than Tossing. …
— I don’t think PItt will get hammered vs PSU. Pitt will likely lose though.
— I agree Pitt will lose at UCF. This is UCF’s home game vs a P5 team and they will make the most of it.
— I think ND will be more like this past year than they were 2 years ago … unfortunately
— Until Pitt can beat UNC, I cannot predict a W
— I do think Pitt can beat VT. It’s defense lost some good players to the NFL, just hope their offense doesn’t turn it around too much
— after last season, Miami will be primed especially at home.
Can Pitt have another 5 win season? … sure. Can they win 8 games … yes, but not likely. I see 6 wins with the 7th coming against a weaker bowl opponent.
wwb
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I have to agree with Jay, far more likely we win 5 rather than 8, not pessimistic, just analysis.
I would put the over under at 6. I think I put it at 7 last year, in hindsight, pretty optimistic, but I didn’t figure our O-line would be so bad as well as QB play.
We won 8 games when our offense was strong and our schedule was easier, so I’d say 8 would mean, everything went our way, and that’s not likely.
While we all would like to think that Pickett will be great, he is young and will make mistakes, especially if the line is porous.
But no one really has a crystal ball so for now all predictions are valid.
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The Caps were supposed to lose to the Pens because they can’t beat the Pens. Brassard was picked up by the Pens because he is Mr Playoffs. Neither happened. What happened before at PITT has little to do with what happens this year. I just don’t buy the VT and or Miami jinx. Any given Saturday. ike
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UNC is at home vs Pitt and had a host of injuries last year. I expect them to be much better this year.
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Oh BTW Jay91, 1.75 Liter Gray Goose Vodka is well under $75 down here in Georgia So I’m putting in my request early.
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Many are already starting to predict PITT will go 1-3 with the OOC schedule. I call Huff the third to the stand…. Would PITT be a different team if they played 4 cupcakes and went 4-0 against them? I think that would make them 8-4. Same team different opponents.
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ike.
Appalachian State beat Michigan on any given Saturday. Does that mean they would have gone 7-2 in the Big 10 that year? You have to look at the TOTALITY of the season.
Tom.
“Albany, penn state, GT, UNC, UCF, Syracuse, Duke, Virginia & Wake Forest” is nine, right? So, with a minor bowl win (they usually don’t send 9-win teams to minor bowl games) and a “wiggle room” loss, It would be 9-4. No?
Look. I root WAAAYYY to hard every game for a win and I agree I should put Pitt games in a more proper perspective. But, I watch A LOT of college football and while I’m far from an expert and admit I can’t see the future, Commander Reed will attest to the fact that my predictions are usually pretty spot on when it comes to our performance.
One thing we all share is a love for Pitt football. Some of us just put more stock in DATA and HISTORY than FAITH. I don’t look at a glass “half-empty” or “half full” but simply .5 of a glass.
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You are right. More wiggle Jay91. It was a quick tally but I’ll be satisfied with 8. The penn state game is a reach & totally an emotional prediction. They’re over rated and deserve Pitt to beat them yet again. Hope I’m right.
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I fully agree with this..
“Many are already starting to predict PITT will go 1-3 with the OOC schedule. I call Huff the third to the stand…. Would PITT be a different team if they played 4 cupcakes and went 4-0 against them? I think that would make them 8-4. Same team different opponents.”
I just don’t understand the point.
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I have no clue how many games we’re going to win in football. I’ll wait to see how Training Camp plays out and who ends up as the starters and who overachieved in Camp. Really hoping that Houdini is the real deal, cause this team really needs a game breaker dynamic type on offense.
I will say this before Camp start…….we better beat Wake Forest and their less than 5000 undergrads
But these are the types of games, like Northwestern, we have a tendency to play down to their level and lose.
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Did UCF win because of talent or coaching? If they played in a P5 conference, would they have been undefeated? If you look at recruiting rankings, they did not win on talent … and their most talented kid just got drafted by the Seahawks … and their entire coaching staff, which probably had a lot to do with their record, is gone. UCF is an oddity and I really wouldn’t put much stock into what they did last season. The odds of them repeating that magic are not very high. They may beat Pitt but I highly doubt we’re looking a double digit win team next season. Frost is a special coach. I’m not sure the spark is there without him.
To be clear, I’m not putting odds on next season. I’m not saying Pitt is more likely to win 8 games vs. 5 games.
What I am saying is that it’s a realistic expectation that Pitt could win 8 games based on that schedule … and if Pitt does not reach 8 wins, it’s reached the moment where I think Duzz’s vision for the program should be questioned.
5-7 in year three is fine. It’s a very common dip year for coaches since it’s traditionally the transition year. 5-7 in year four is certainly not as acceptable nor should it be.
By the way, the last 35 years mean jack. I’ve said it before, but every time you get a new coach the clock starts over. If you look at the last 3 years, 8 wins is very doable seeing as Duzz has already done it twice.
I still say Pitt should win 10 games so I don’t understand how 8 wins is optimistic. It seems like that should be the floor not the ceiling. Especially considering how, as I’ve already shown, that Pitt is recruiting at a level that can get them into the 21-25 spot of the rankings.
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Concerning scheduling, 2 perfect examples of programs that reached their pinnacle on lame opponents: were JoePedo’s scheduling at Creepy Valley State, which might have cost them a couple National titles in the late 60’s.
And JoePedo protege, Greg Pedo Schiano at Buttgers in the mid 2000’s.
Buttgers non-con was usually laughable but it got them an 11-2 season, two (2) 9 win season and two(2) 8 win seasons. Which was the best stretch Buttgers had since the late ’70’s under
Major Frank ‘Needlenose’ Burns
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Guard Xavier Johnson is now officially a member of Pitt’s 2018 roster.
This morning, Jeff Capel announced that Johnson (Arlington, Virginia) has signed his Letter of Intent and is a Pitt Panther.
Among the honors Johnson received this year was being named the Washington Catholic Athletic Conference Player of the Year, McDonald’s All-American nominee and first team all-state by the Virginia Independent School Athletic Association.
ESPN rates Johnson as a 4-star guard and the 33rd best point guard in the nation.
Capel still has four scholarships available for this year’s roster.
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That is some great analysis about the 2018 pit teen. Let me throw this out any team that has Shane Roy as a starting defensive lineman and Connor Dintino and Mike Herndon as starting offensive lineman is in a world of hurt.
He’ll those two OL weren’t good enough to start on last year’s terrible OL and now the are 2/5th and surrounded by other journeyman anda walk_ on
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Yea…..but but but…..the guy from Kent State is coming 🙂
And the community college guys as well
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+1 ….this is exactly what I communicated in my first and only roundtable last year. Mainly Roy and Dintino.
I have repeated it on here at least ten times about the offensive line. It is perfectly acceptable to have a walk-on offensive lineman when you surround him with 4 star talent as many programs do. When you rely on walk-ons as the core of your line and also about the walk-ons on defense and the high school wide receiver we have as a LB. for a few years, your recruiting is not getting better.
If our recruiting is getting better, the recruits should pass the walkons for playing time, not push them for it.
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And Pitt finally has an X-Man !!!
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Tossing.
Pitt SHOULD win 10 games? Not COULD? What ten games SHOULD Pitt win?
In your own prediction above you listed 3 games that “lean” toward the opponent and one you predict a “coin flip”. By definition, those are COULD games.
Please list the 10 games SHOULD not COULD win.
To be transparent, I believe Pitt SHOULD win versus Albany, Syracuse, Virginia and Wake Forest. Games they COULD win are GT, UNC, VT (although ike is RIGHT. Pitt technically COULD win any game on the schedule– Pitt even COULD beat Alabama, though very unlikely). Pitt COULD also could pull an upset.
But, you said above, “Pitt SHOULD” win 10 games. Please list those. I’m curious.
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FWIW ESPN projected win totals for Pitt- 4.5-7.5 games.
While I admit it’s difficult to win .5 games, the number seems about right.
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Tossing.
One last thing.. You said “Pitt SHOULD win 10 games” and also said “I’m not saying Pitt is more likely to win 8 games vs. 5 games”.
Huh??
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If the defense performs at a high level and the OL stays injury free Pitt could be competitive in almost every game with Pickett at QB.
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Jay, my point is. As you pointed out that PITT with your scenario could end up 5-7. Reasonable enough and I think a real possibility. Different and lighter schedule they could end up 8-4. It’s the exact same team right? So does a more reasonable schedule take away all the boogeymen still haunting PITT football to this day for you or will it take a weird bounce of the ball to sway PITT’s season one way or another? You’re right above, you have to take the entire season into account when reaching a conclusion concerning how this PITT football team fared and played last year and how they will play this coming season. Wins and losses are black and white. A football season is terminally grey. ike
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We’re finding some common ground, ike.
And changing the schedule IS a good idea, if only to put Pitt on par with other teams. It’s hard to compare apples to apples when some teams, like Pitt, play in a P5 conference and then load up the OOC and others, like PSU (historically) load up on cupcakes.
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Jay91 – When I say “should” I’m implying that I believe Pitt, as a program, is capable of being a 10 win program. Maybe not this season, maybe not next but the program should be built to sustain 10 win seasons. Using 10 wins as the benchmark, I see 8 wins as pessimistic … Especially entering year 4.
That statement does not take into consideration the current roster or coaching staff or money. Just a blanket statement on Pitt football and what I feel they should be striving for.
Reed – I think you’re too pessimistic on the O-line. We have no idea what the offense will look like this season. If it’s the same one as last season, you’re absolutely right. If they incorporate a faster tempo with read/run option and more roll outs and quicker passes then it can be masked. That’s the entire reason the spread is so prevalent now.
My point is we should wait and see what Pitt’s offensive philosophy is this season. My hope, and belief, is that it will be different than what we’ve seen the last two years. Pitt had a drop back QB last season so it was built for that. We have a more mobile QB this season so it should be tailored to that.
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It’s fun to predict what might happen………… I guess if we are all on the beam in some sort of way or another we should think ahead of impending situations to some degree. More importantly, should we be a little cautious and proceed with parameters before we get in our cars and start out driving? I would guess depending on ones thought process, some may never leave the driveway in fear of losing control or worse yet, the ball bouncing the wrong way… . I’m all for thinking PITT will arrive safely at journey’s end come late 2018. So let’s take that drive.. . . ike
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TT I’m on your side of the ledger when it comes to the possibilities for Pitt FB going forward. BUT having a very very talented QB running the show year in and year out is a must to play at the 10 win level any given season.
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Tossing.
“I believe Pitt, as a program, is capable of being a 10 win program. Maybe not this season, maybe not next but the program should be built to sustain 10 win seasons.”
We agree there, 100%. Pitt COULD be that type of program. Fans like you and I believe Pitt SHOULD be a program like that. In fact, I actually expect Pitt to be a 8-9 win team consistently with 6 wins the bottom and 10-11 wins the top. That’s a perennial Top 25 program. To accept less is to embrace mediocrity.
Alas, we are NOT CURRENTLY a program like that.
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ike.
Agreed. But to take that drive with no seat belt, in a convertible with a cold one in your hand and a spliff burning in the ash tray and a naked model riding shotgun might lead to more than a “ball” bouncing the wrong way..
But hey, what a way to go!
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Jay, two things as I like to say. One, what choice do we have? and two. What a way to go brother… the only way… ….. ike
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All I’m going to say is this: Any team that has rsSR Shane Roy as a starting DL and both rsSR Conner Dintino and rsSR Mike Herndon as starting OL is in for a long rough ride – especially on offense.
Dintino and Herndon could never even break into Pitt’s actual two-deep at any position for any length of time and now they are starters… what in Hell does that tell yo?.
Then you have the Kent State transfer from a MAC team that had literally horrid OL play as shown here:
Total Offense – 127th (out of 129 teams)
Passing Offense – 123rd
Rushing Offense – 80th
Pass Efficiency – 126th
Sacks allowed – 127th (46 allowed)
Tackles for loss allowed – 129th (dead last) and maybe worse of all…
3rd Down Conversions – 126th (converted only 28.7% of attempts).
28.7% on third downs my friends which was 50 out of 174 tries. We sucked at it last year and still made 37%.
That scares the crap out of me. I wasn’t all that excited about Hodges last season who came from D1 Texas but this Millin move is desperation.
You can say all you want but Millin was their Left Tackle on a 2-10 team!! The guy whose primary responsibility is to protect the QB and give him time to pass failed miserably – regardless of what he did against the Celmson player…
Add this guy to Dintino, Herndon and Morrissey – who was a below average Center albeit it young last year – and it has the makings of a true disaster. Their alternatives are even worse with JUCO and CC OL guys who haven’t taken a D1 snap in their lifetimes.
Let’s hope Bookser is able to play three positions at once.
This is why i’m not overly optimistic about our offense this coming season.
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I sure hope some of these Pitt players read your blog Reed. This opinion is suitable for the bulletin board. Motivation.
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New article up…
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Over under is 6 wins
Maybe Pitt gets lucky and wins 8-9
But I can also see them winning 4
Going to be tough to recruit in front of 40k empty seats and another year of not bowling
I don’t see any sure wins
But I don’t see any sure losses either
That’s mediocre to me. 6-6
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But which four games do they win? And if any of them are home games and attendence is more than 25,000 then there could be less than 40,000 empry yellow seats to recruit in front of. In your face!🤣🤣🤣
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Pitt fans know all too well that Pitt will lose a game that is winnable and it should win. Does anyone doubt this? I think it will be GT or NC again, or maybe both. I would say that Pitt should go 8-4 but then throw in the typical unexpected loss, and the season will end up 7-5 with another bowl loss added on.
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VoR – You’re basing that on the past as if Pitt is cursed. The problem with Pitt, the last 35 years, has been the administration. Nothing more. You can’t have success on the field with out support up top. Pitt seems unlucky because you create your own luck … Pitt has not been set up to create it’s own luck.
Narduzzi appears to have that now from Heather and we’ll find out over the next two seasons if he was the right hire. He’s not going anywhere before that.
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Agreed, Tossing, except that I recently pointed out that the Chancellor position has been pretty stable over the past 20 years, with very few changes. Pitt’s situation is higher than the average across the country where the tenure is much shorter in most cases. They have made some bad decisions in the AD area, but the big decisions such as moving to Heinz for football required top level approval including the BoT. I have said before that the decision to bring back Cornhole set the football program back a generation.
But the FB coach hiring decisions crossed the tenures of several different ADs and AD fill ins. I don’t think Pitt is cursed, as I’m happy with my decision to go there, but you must agree that some of the losses to inferior teams over the years supports a healthy dose of skepticism.
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VoR – The last 3 years? Who did they lose to? In 2017, the only game they lost that Pitt was favored to win was against UNC. CUSE was favored in their matchup.
The Northwestern Bowl Game was the only upset in 2016.
In 2015, they did not lose a single game they were favored to win.
So, they’ve lost two games in 3 years that they were favored to win. Most teams in the country would take that.
So, I’m not sure what you mean by losing to inferior teams? Chryst did not leave Pitt in good shape. He had a recruiting class in the 40’s his final season and that parlayed into a 65th rated class during the transition year when Duzz came on board.
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^^ Not my dog in this debate but I really do feel HCPC recruiting classes are very over-rated.
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TT, just doing a quick look back, I think they have lost to NC the last 3 years, GT a couple of times, Navy in 2015 and don’t forget Akron in 2014. Plus Northwestern in the bowl game. (almost Youngstown St last year) I realize there were some reasons for this, such as the adjustment to new systems brought in by new coaches. But my point is that they will find a way to lose to a team they should beat such as NC or GT. This year it could be UCF looking ahead to Pedo.
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VoR – Pitt was not favored in any of those games, however. You’re overvaluing Pitt when you call those other teams inferior when, in fact, Pitt was the inferior opponent.
Ike – You’re 100% right about Chryst. He recruited safe and over-purged the program. The last two classes Chryst left Pitt were ranked #44 and #65 (no offensive linemen). The bad thing about those two classes is that they should be the strength of the team. Those two classes are now redshirt seniors and either redshirt juniors or true seniors now.
Everyone complains about the recruiting but the honest to God truth is that bulk of Duzz’s recruiting is True Junior/Redshirt Sophomores or younger.
That’s why getting to this season and next has been the journey it has been. We’ll finally get some judgement on Duzz beginning this season.
Pitt has lost only two games they were favored in the last 3 seasons, but also has wins against VT, Miami and Clemson in the same span.
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