Are We Accepting Averageness?

For years I have been stating that the University of Pittsburgh’s football program has held a place in the echelons of college football that was sort of like being in limbo.  Setting all the excruciating concise details of that concept aside it basically means we had died and been on the verge of hell forever.

But that was a bit harsh, so I modified my thinking to us being akin to a long-range airship that never had clearance to either land safely nor soar above the clouds – sort of like being on a solar powered dirigible that just kept going around in circles for years no matter how hard the crew tried to make it do something different.

In plain English I feel the program is solidly ensconced in the bottom of the top half of the 128 D1 football teams in America.  We hover between the 32-64 team rankings almost every week of every year we play football. Almost every week that is.

Some seasons we do rise above that – this year was one of them. Last year was also, at least for a while. But we never seem to be able to make that sustained push to get us into the Top 20 rankings on any sort of regular basis.  This remains the case with numerous changes in head coaches, staff coaches, athletic Directors and Chancellors… no matter how good or bad they are; how well-liked or hated,  it stays about the same.

Here is the last 12 years of Pitt football with the weekly AP polls listed:


Take special note as to the number of times we were ranked during the season as opposed to the end of the year.  Seven times we were in the Top 25 during the playing weeks – only twice were we after the final game.  Does that sound familiar?  It should – it just happened over the last two years.

But this year we were poised to do something really good and let it slip away again.  Now, people who know me from here or on the Blather or a long time ago on the message boards might be surprised to hear me say that – given my thoughts that an eight win season is about what Pitt is good for.

But things change year-to-year and during every week during the football season.  And in this season I watched our kids come out and start scoring points like it was going out of style. After the Penn State game I thought to myself that this could be one of those magical seasons where dreams start to come true and we rise above our less-than lofty historical heights.

We put up 60 points in our first two games and that was with a James Conner who wasn’t in true form yet and with a lopsided emphasis on the running game anyway.  I felt that once Peterman was allowed to start airing it out and Conner regained his beast mode then the sky would be the limit.

Unfortunately no one told Josh Conklin and the defense that. So we watched Pitt score points galore and then start to lose games – back to back against OK State and North Carolina where we gave up 81 points in two matches.

That started a trend where we were forced to have our offense maintain an almost unreasonable level of point production to win games because we allowed an unheard of amount of points at same time.

I put that there for a reason and not just to ruin your day. What we have seen lately is a bit of a resurgence in the program under Pat Narduzzi who was hired over the 2014-5 off-season to inject some desperately needed energy and excitement into the program.  He’s done that so far although I think he’s supplemented it a little bit more with off-field tools (twitter, internet, videos, dog and pony shows) than he has on the field of play.

But his on the field accomplishments need to be given real credit also.  Last year he broke through the seven win barrier by going 8-5; this season he replicated that record but had also sterling wins against our rival Penn State at home then against the eventual national Champs Clemson in Death Valley.

Let’s applaud him for that as that is something this program has needed in a big way. 

But the fact of life in college ball though, at least on the national scale and with the national polls is a loud and strong “What have you done lately?” and with Pitt that meant our ending the season with a resounding thud in our bowl game.

If anyone on here thinks that Pinstripe bowl game and the 9th win it would have represented wasn’t important as any of the regular season games, even Clemson and Penn State, they are mistaken.

A 9th win would have put us in the Top 20 (not just Top 25 but Top 20) instead of “receiving votes” and it would have given us real and viable national recognition across the board.

We all saw how long that Clemson win stayed in the national conversation – less than a month because no one talked about it during the championship game run-up hardly at all. It wasn’t mentioned during the actual game once.

We fans love that upset win but it was truly old news to the rest of the college football world by the time the championship game rolled around.  But had Pitt finished up around  #19 or maybe even better, at the end of the season? That makes people sit up and take notice.

Going into that bowl game we were at #22 and were trending upward.  A win would have given us something we have done only once in 14 years when we were #15 back in 2008,  then again way back to 2002 when we were #19 at season’s end.

That bowl loss was a huge blow for us and to think it wasn’t, to minimize it as I’m hearing Pitt fans do now,  is truly SOP in my opinion.  It was a chance at real national recognition, better recruiting leverage and would have had us going into the off-season with three win’s momentum.  All of which are vitally important to a program trying to shed it’s rather mediocre past reputation.

Instead all I hear about the bowl game now is that is was a ho-hum minor bowl, unimportant really and good only for the extra practices for the kids (seriously, I just read someone allude to that)… when nothing is farther from the truth.

It was a chance to be what fans have wanted us to be for years – nine wins again, with real and sustained progress shown in the win column. It would have been a break in our bowl game losing streak,  a record which now stands at 1-5 over the last six bowls, and a chance to be more highly ranked than we have been in a long time.  Not just at this season’s end but we would have been ranked above much higher going into next season also.

Funny thing this defeatist attitude. Everyone hates the phrase Same Old Pitt until we slip into it again, then they make a million excuses for why it happens.  But it really isn’t the loss itself that is SOP – it is our fan’s post-game attitudes in that we’ll just gloss over the importance of the game itself and act like it was no big deal to, again, end a season on a definite down note.

After all, we’ve done it so many times before. Well, we get what we wish for, don’t we?

Walking into Heinz Field on the Saturday after our great Clemson win and seeing all those empty seats should have slapped me in the face with the truth behind Pitt football.  No one really gives a crap except to talk about the program and the team.

Everything else on the majority of the fans’ part is just window dressing and blown smoke.  Average?  Sure, we’ll take it, as long as we don’t have to actually do anything to help make the program better… like actually sitting in seats for a game you already paid for.  That would be a damned good start.



189 thoughts on “Are We Accepting Averageness?

  1. Geez, Reed. Beating Clemson is supposed to instantly translate into all the seats being filled the next week? We are an urban-based school, not one located in the middle of nowhere. We compete for the limited number of dollars that people can spend to attend events. Until we can capture those dollars and fill the seats, I would love to see us giving tickets to kids, veterans, police, etc.



  2. Are we going to hear about our bowl loss until August when fall camp arrives? Consider this … we haven’t won a bowl game vs a P5 opponent since after the 2010 season. The only bowl game we did win since was versus a MAC team who couldn’t tackle James Conner if their lives depended on it.

    Versus Northwestern, we lost:

    1) our 2nd best defensive player for the entire game
    2) our star RB and inspirational leader late in the 2nd quarter, and
    3 & 4) our All-American OG and starting QB late in the 3rd quarter

    Yet, we still took the lead in the 4th quarter .

    Is there any other team that could have absorbed all of these losses, and won their bowl game?

    The answer is a big fat NO!!!!


  3. I don’t know that we are accepting averageness (is that a word?) but we sure expect it because it is the norm.

    Just when things are looking really good we have the flop in New York. Something we have all come to expect. Just the thing to take the luster off of what was an excellent season. Just the thing to take the momentum away from the program.

    I have been sharing my concern over this years recruiting which has to be much better than average if we want to get better. Three weeks left to improve the class. This is the most important thing to get done if we are to break through our average ceiling. We had the players that made big plays on offense, not enough big plays on defense. Coaches are only as good as the players they recruit.

    Attendance for Duke and Syracuse was disappointing but expected, the season was front loaded, lots of season tickets sold to PSU fans, and to corporate interests. Duke and Syracuse plus crummy weather don’t have the entertainment value that Pittsburgh Sports Fans are willing to support.

    Hopefully, the new AD will be more creative in marketing to people that will actually attend.


  4. The Duke game attendance is the greatest example of what the problem is at Pitt. That was a total disgrace and slap in the face of every player and coach, I thought Pitt would lose because of it when I sat down in my seat IN HEINZ FIELD. Credit Narduzzi for getting the players to ignore the yellow. Until our “fans” step up things will never change. It sure was cold for the last 2-3 Steeler games yet I saw a pretty full stadium, even for the Cleveland game so cold as an excuse is lame.


  5. The AD can only do so much. We finished in the Top 10 from ’76 thru ’82 but still could walk up to the ticket window before any game where the opponent wasn’t PSU, WVU or ND and buy a ticket …. AT OUR OCS!

    Miami had the same issues back in the 80s and 90s .. and of course, still do. The only relief for us would be to plant a bomb in the Stiller locker room …. and still that would only be temporary.


  6. I just don’t see us ever filling Heinz. Maybe we can sell the tickets, but we won’t put butts in the seats. There aren’t more than 35,000 to 40,000 or so fans that are going to come to Pitt games against teams like Duke, Marshall, Syracuse, Virginia, etc. Probably a few less than that in crummy weather. Even if we are a highly-ranked, winning team, you might get 45,000 to 50,000. That’s it.

    We get higher attendance when ND, PSU, WVU play here — because they bring thousands of their own fans. The casual Pitt may also show up for those games. But the casual Pitt fan isn’t coming to Syracuse or Duke. Sorry.

    People keep talking about that Cincinnati game (I still have nightmares of Mardy Gilyard). But Cinncy brought how many of their own fans to that one.


  7. Pitt will never sell out Heinz except for the biggest events. So an effort needs to be made to get the fans that do attend closer to the field, instead of in the upper deck. Flip the home field so the TV cameras focus on the stands that are filled. Perception is important. Put the student section behind the team bench.

    Canvas the upper decks, It is not brain surgery. It is just laziness by the athletic department not to address these issues.

    We need an AD with a brain, not someone that brags about season tickets, when everyone knew the truth.
    Not an AD that disparages Pitt Fans at a press conference. We need someone that will actually make improvements to the game day experience and actively work to improve attendance.

    Forty five thousand people in the lower bowl would look a lot better than spread out over a 70,000 seat stadium. Figure out the logistics and make it happen. Do the work and quit being lazy.

    Liked by 1 person

  8. A lot of good points made, I don’t see Pitt having a full stadium unless they play an old rival that has a traveling fan base.

    Correct me if I’m wrong but the only ACC team that brings a good quantity of fans is VT?

    Pitt competes for entertainment dollar and yes we are 4th on the pole behind the pro teams.

    They need an OCS 45,000 seat stadium but I can’t see it happening because of the financial commitment.

    As stated earlier Pitt stadium for 55 million could have been domed and upgraded with luxury boxes in the late 80’s to early 90’s. They missed the opportunity at a reasonable price and passed.


  9. I’m not sure it is as simple as tarping off the upper decks. How much revenue does Pitt get from selling tickets up in those areas? Yes, having a more intimate stadium would create a better environment for college football and make the atmosphere better. But Pitt is also using football to maximize the dollars coming in to the athletic department. Selling 55,000 season tickets, including 20,000+ in the upper decks, brings in revenue — even if a large percentage of those people don’t show up to the games.


  10. Not sure the limitations should have worn out on the Pinstripe loss. It was only two weeks ago. In fairness, who was Pitt’s best defensive player? Assuming Whitehead and I don’t think that was true in 2016. BTW I happen to think Galambos was Pitt’s best defensive player in the Pinstripe. Pitt played without its star running back last season and still had a 1000 yard rusher.

    I think the point of this post is spot on. Pitt has not consistently been regarded very well. Much of that is due to the team and their performance in seasons when chances were available. Pitt had multiple chances to punch NW in the first half of the Pinstripe and failed (fumble, slip, interception). Then in the second half with fumble, missed FG and dropped TD pass. They also surrendered career yardage on the ground.

    I think pointing out the earlier bowl failures underscores the larger point that Pitt can’t just aspire, the team needs to execute on the field. Tanking to Navy last year. Blowing a huge lead to Houston. Failing to show against Ole Miss and SMU. Pitt even struggled to beat Bowling Green in Detroit.

    Pitt had a backloaded home schedule with a real chance to win the coastal in 2015 and then lost to ND, Miami and UNC playing from behind after poor first half showings.

    In 2014 Pitt fumbled on its first four possessions against a very good GT team (#12) and played from four touchdowns down as a result. Fumbles aside Pitt had a great chance to win that game. They had a chance to beat a very good Duke team (#24 at the time) the next game and missed a FG to win in regulation. Pitt also lost to Akron in 2014.

    In 2010 Pitt was ranked #19 and was completely blown out by Miami at home. Pitt had a chance for the Big East title and blew a clinching game to UConn, then completely botched a home game to WVU. The sad end to the DW era.

    In 2009 Pitt had a chance to win the Big East at home and lost to Cincy (Still one of the greatest games I’ve seen). They seemed disinterested (I was there) in losing to WVU in Morgantown the preceding game. Had they beaten WVU they may have reached the Top 10.

    Carpe Diem!

    I honestly expected the poor turnout for the Duke and Syracuse games even after the Clemson victory. For the record I attended both with all my seats filled. The weather was bad for Duke and that team wasn’t good this season. Syracuse just doesn’t feel like a rivalry even though cast as one. Syracuse was also a poor team and the game was on Thanksgiving weekend. In the end if Pitt ever regularly exceeds expectations and then consistently meets them, fans will show up regardless of the Steelers, Penguins or Pirates. That is actually the reason that people pay attention to the Steelers and Penguins even in down years. The teams have sometimes exceeded expectations and have consistently met those for years.


  11. How about a program in which a person with a ticket, who cannot attend a game, can donate it for use by a kid, veteran, cop, EMT, etc? Make tickets available free for all local high school football teams, their coaches, their cheerleaders, etc.

    What did Randy Juhl say last year, something like “If we can develop the polio vaccine and CPR, we can do this.”


  12. Barvo, FWIW, I disagree with just about everything you wrote.

    1st off, I said ‘2nd’ best defensive player. On the long TD where Northwestern retook the lead in the 4th, do you think Whitehead would have completely whiffed on the tackle like Briggs did? What a pathetic attempt! I really hate to cut up a college player who are out there trying their best … but Briggs, Webb and a few others (and a few others) are not P5 players, as proven a large handful of times this year. And that goes for pass coverage, tackling, taking proper angles, etc You can only teach so much.

    In the GT game in 2014, do you really think it was only the fumbles? GT had 465 yards rushing, and over 600 yards total offense … and scored 53 points, all the while still playing the back-ups almost the entire 4th quarter.

    In 2010, the 19th pre-season ranking was fool’s gold. Go back and look …. Pitt returned 11 starters that year (the least i the BE) while UConn and WVU returned 17 and 18 respectively. The only reason Pitt was ranked pre-season was because they finished 15th the year before.

    I do agree that more people will show up if Pitt continually exceeds expectations, but for some reason, expectations remain very high for Pitt despite all of the SOP screw-ups.


  13. Nice chart there Reed with the past PITT football season won/lost records. I couldn’t help but notice the 3 best years recently were the years 2008-2010 and what did PITT do? They fired the coach that’s what. Even many fans were talking that Wanny should go. There is your SOP. Oh, and then they hired a couple of nimrods to make sure they buried the program.

    and that dam bowl game? Some of you just don’t want to let that go, why? Because Stocker didn’t play? All of a sudden this guy is the great PITT savior? Where was he all season if he was so great.

    Georgie Aston inexplicably slipped down while waltzing into the endzone after a tackle reverse pass attempt. Nice call for the outgoing Canada. Next drive PITT has first and goal and NP throws an interception on 2nd down.

    After all this plus two terrible non-calls that take out the QB and RB, PITT still takes the lead. I don’t remember ever watching a game like that let alone SOP.

    BTW, I think Jarrett was the second best defensive player this year.


  14. Pitt finally the right administration in place to make a move in the college football world along with a coach who understand the QB position pretty well for being a defensive guy.

    As for settling for being average. Those fans want 85 choir boys on the roster along with not wanting to play the dirty recruiting games have to accept being average because that’s the best you can do under those circumstances. Asking for anything more is hypocritical. Sadly, Pitt has these kinds of fans.


  15. I received a postcard from the NCAA Student-Athlete Concussion Injury Litigation today. Fortunately I was never concussed in my sport. Anyway, it will be interesting to see what happens.

    How will this affect College Sports moving forward?


  16. Forgot to add: PITT is already in the top 25 for next year. Why don’t we chew on that instead of one over-rated loss in a lowly thought of bowl game.

    and, I’m not saying I didn’t badly want to win that game at all but that’s over for me…moving on…


  17. I’ve found the main problem with recruiting choirboys is that they continually trip over their robes on the open field……


  18. Ike – when the time comes that we don’t talk about what has happened in the past with Pitt football – whether it be two weeks or 40 years is the time we all should turn off our computers, phones and just not discuss Pitt at all.

    But to your question about Stocker – you really should rephrase it to read if DiNucci was any damn good why wasn’t he the QB2 all year? Why wasn’t he practicing with the 1st and 2nd string offenses instead of running the scout team squads – which he did all season long.

    Why didn’t DiNucci take some snaps in real action during the season if he fits into future plans? it wouldn’t have cost any eligibility, he already had a redshirt year. He didn’t because the staff felt he was the 3rd best option (at best) for the whole regular season. I’ll go as far as to say that if Peterman got hurt and Stocker was out earlier in the 1st half of the season I believe the staff would have burned MacVitte’s redshirt before playing DiNucci

    Truthfully, I think there was something else going on with the staff and Stocker because everyone I talked to at the game and since then can’t figure out that QB personnel move at all – except for you.

    You just do not use a bowl game that might get you a 9th win and a highest ranking we have had in decades just to get a scrub some practice snaps. You do that when you are 6-6 or something and the bowl game is just a fun trip for the kids.


  19. Hold on, I don’t mean to imply that all things PITT shouldn’t be discussed here and/or everywhere. I’ll be sure to alter my replies so that they don’t give off that impression. To me it’s more about the negative focus over that one game, that when you think about it was very bizarre.

    About DiNucci? I’m betting that I’m right on that decision to sit down an outgoing backup QB over a returning player. Plus calling Ben a scrub is a little harsh wouldn’t you say? The other difference being early games vs later on games. The slanted reviews on Ben’s play are very biased depending on what point one is trying to convey..I thought he played OK.

    ******* I hope we never see DiNucci start though but you never know. Now Reed, this coming off the heels of your LAST article about QB’s transferring out. Think about that for a second…isn’t this the type of thing you were talking about? and wouldn’t it stand to reason that maybe this was also in the back of Narduzzi’s mind by giving the kid some quality snaps in extra practices? You’re almost arguing against yourself there…:) ……………….ike


  20. OK – Manny Stocker has the exact same pedigree as hometown favorite Thomas MacVitte has. Stocker was a Rival’s 3* QB recruit who had offers from NC State, Cincinnati, Temple, Eastern Michigan and Virginia Military.

    Gee – put those up against MacVitte’s Pitt, Miami, OH, Cincinnati and a single 30 second phone call from LSU and you see there isn’t a hell of a lot of on-paper separation there. Actually Stocker’s offers are better you could say.

    DiNucci was a 2* kid and take a look at his offers before Pitt threw him a hometown bone later in the recruiting season:

    Of course in reality Stocker has at least played in a game, has been named QB2 and taking practice snaps for a full year so I’d say that he has something going for him as a back-up QB. Which is exactly what MacVitte will be next season.

    I’m not saying Stocker is a great QB but I watched him throw a few times in passing drills just as I saw DiNucci in drills and I could see why Stocker was chosen as the #2 and DiNucci wasn’t.

    It makes no difference to me what position Stocker was brought into Pitt to play – he was returned to QB for a reason and stayed there for 95% of the season. James Conner was a DE recruit; Gonzalez a QB recruit — players move around to fill needs.

    So what does that say about DiNucci that not only did the staff take a WR and place him above DiNucci on the depth chart but kept him there all year? My point all along is that was a very strange substitution to happen in a game that important – at least important in my eyes.


  21. Pitt winning 8 games and beating PSU and Clemson certainly was NOT SOP.

    It is SOP fans only. Not showing up for games and continuously bitching.

    Pitt needs to go 9 wins and up in the future. Period.


  22. Reed
    I don’t get the obsession with the Stocker thing. It really doesn’t matter. No one knows if Stocker would have played better. I highly doubt it. He certainly would not have made the TD pass Ben made. Narduzzi is going to play the QB that gives us the best chance to win. Period. It was DiNucci. It isn’t some big conspiracy.

    Obviously DiNucci took lots of the snaps in the weeks leading up to the bowl game so he played. Maybe they had some live scrimmages for the guys that didn’t play this year and Ben outplayed Stocker. Maybe Stocker made zero improvements over the course of the year and DiNucci made huge strides.

    The point is, none of us truly know what happened in practice and in the locker room throughout the year and in the weeks leading up to the bowl game. Only the coaches know.


  23. But apparently, Stocker didn’t remain there. On TV, and I’m sure some here will back this up, the announcers said that despite what the depth chart shown, they were told by the Pitt coaches that DiNucci had become the 2nd teamer.

    Anyone who was watching TV …. can you confirm this?


  24. Notrocket @ 12:48 …. a big +1.

    And sadly, I am as guilty as anyone … I did not make the 2 hour trip for the Duke game but instead stayed home and watched it.


  25. I can’t stand when Pitt loses a bowl game that it doesn’t matter and it is “just an exhibition” to some fans.

    Baloney. Pitt was playing for nine wins, a final ranking and for its seniors. What happens? A 10-0 lead was wide open and Aston slipped and fell. The end result was Northwestern goes 99 yards and seized momentum. Aston’s slip is emblematic with the problems this program has been facing for decades now. Players, no matter how good they are off and on the field, fail to step up and make plays far too often.


  26. Football and basketball attendance being down is not just a Pitt thing folks. It is a growing issue with most sports.


  27. Predicted 2017 Pitt home game attendance
    YSU: 47,168
    OK St: 53,491
    Rice: 43,246
    Miami: 45,116
    Virginia: 37,308
    NC St: 40,720
    NC: 44,552


  28. Averageness can be tied to cash flow. Simple as that.

    According to tax records filed by the AAC/Big East for 2012-13, Pitt got $10.2 million.

    In 2013-14, Pitt received approximately $18.9M from the ACC.

    In 2014-15 Pitt received $25M from the ACC. 11th out of 14 teams.

    We have achieved averageness because our athletic cash flow has been average at best. The SEC pulled in over $32M per team in 14-15. That does not take into consideration other revenue streams from vendors. I would like to know the “Real” number we get from all sources. We will never see that however. Another Higher Ed trick to confuse the lawmakers so we keep state and federal funding consistent.

    The Administration will never understand the concept of investment into your major athletic programs today will turn into multiples of that investment in the years that follow. That is why OCS must be considered if we ever want to grow the university into something big. If we want to stay average, not a problem. Just say it.

    Back to athletics. For the funds we get, we are above averageness in recent results in football. I am trying to figure out how our spending went through the roof as soon as we found some riches, compliments of the ACC. We went from a 10M payout in 2012-13 to $25M in 2014-15. Why haven’t we put aside $3-5M per year to start funding an OCS with our new average riches? In 10 years, you would be ready to break ground with a $50m fund already in place. Please stop with a billion dollar cost estimate. For a 45k stadium, it is under $300m. Put it down by the bridge.

    I always tell my customers that if you want me to build you a “C” program, it will cost you blank. If you want an “A” program, it will cost you blank+. It is an Administrative decision and our has failed in this respect for the last 30 years.


  29. It is what it is – to use that horrible, but appropriate, hackneyed phrase.

    I’m an old timer, undergrad during Dorsett, grad school during Marino. I was there at the ’77 Sugar Bowl, so deep in the recesses of my aging brain, I have fantasies of Pitt as a national power again.

    But then I snap back to reality and realize that just isn’t in the cards. There are too many headwinds. Smallish fanbase, playing in a pro town, competition for recruits etc etc we all know the list. Yeah, all those yellow seats look awful, but I simply refuse to get too upset about it.

    So does that make me too accepting of “average?” I drive up from Hagerstown most weekends. I was in Annapolis and in the Bronx (and really disappointed particularly with the Pinstripe). I think I do my part. I can only control what I do.

    So I concentrate on enjoying what I can – wearing my Pitt gear, tailgates with old friends, seeing some special players and special football moments, being back in my hometown for a while.

    Is this is wrong way to feel about things? Perhaps I should be more upset. Perhaps I’m just too old or jaded, but it’s all fine with me. I will admit that it would be nice before I get too old to attend that we see double-digit wins and a warm-weather bowl.

    But until then, it is what it is. Is it really that bad?


  30. Here is an aerial view of the $3.07M home that Alabama boosters bought for Saban in 2013.

    BigB, you appear to have the biggest pockets here. What do ya think? Make us an A program.


  31. wwb..I do magnets and flags but not mansion building for over-paid coaches. Nor would I support a program that wants to win at all costs.
    A little story When looking at financing retirement,everything I have been told or have read by experts suggest taking no more than 4% out a year of personnel retirement savings. Now these coaches are state employees- a few years back there was a bit of a retirement $$ scandal with an employee working in the state liquor. In one of the articles Deans Smith’s yearly state retirement gave him over $200.000 per year. The highest paid retiree in the NC state retirement system. Using the 4% figure that means he was drawing off the sum of $5,000,000 of the state system if one equates it one equates it to the private sector- a basketball coach…Would love to see what ole Nicky boy will retire with..


  32. Don’t play in a rented dogshit stadium that has no connection to Pitt or campus other than a banner with a Dinocat and a 50 yd logo that looks like Mrs. Jones 3rd grade class painted it on recess.


  33. Spend some money you cheap Administration. Brissel Bob as a Hoops coach is SOP. Guy is gone in 2 years if we hire a real AD or let Barnes collect two checks and use us.


  34. Some random thoughts on a warm, but dreary day:

    1) Ben DeNuccinshould never have to play QB for Pitt. May be a great kid, but after watching him many times in HS kid is not a D1 player. Sorry, but true.

    2) Building an OCS or one in Hazelwood.
    a) Upitt, please post a single picture of any OCS your company has done with the topographical challenges presented by these sites. Hard by a huge hill and a river with one way in and out may be a great place for a defensive fort, but not so much for a ball field. It’s easy when land is flat or rolling hills. The rivers, coal mines, and hills which helped our city and region to prosper now limit its development in the 21st century.
    b) have any of you been up Bates Street lately?? If so you know what I mean. Second Ave, the Parkway, SH tunnels. In my opinion it’s not the bucks for the stadium, is the infrastructure costs.
    c) I will forgive those who are not from a 15 square mile radius of Pittsburgh, but yinzers DO not cross bridges, go thru tunnels, or up hills for any reason. We are a series of very, very, provincial villages, never to mix.
    d) having a field near SS will do nothing for on campus visiting. Might as well be on the North Side. Easy to say build incline or people mover. 20k people 200 at a time?? About the most effective transportation system to a game I personally have seem that is similar is U of Washington, and that is really different geographically.
    e) Schenley park can never be touched, by law, so quit that now, sorry.
    f) These are just some of the reasons I hate Steve Peterson, he took our soul, and it will never come back.

     Eventually, the BOT will die off and be replaced. Those who have new attitudes will gradually take over. For better or worse, I don't know, but the generations upon generations of the SOP, to me are the BOT and administration, not necessarily the fans. That's my story and I'm sticking to it!


  35. Heinz is a dump. That is a real problem. If it was built properly it would not be as bad for Pitt.
    O T How long was Canada at NC State? Game planning against Clemson every year had to give us a leg up this year.


  36. Reed +1

    Admin or lack of vision is to blame.

    You don’t create a connection and reason then you don’t create fans.

    Might as well play in New Kensington or Uniontown or Little Washington. If you aren’t on campus then it doesn’t matter. Buy the land next to Hot Metal and expand Campus. Grow a campus down there new bars and places to eat and apartments. Again, zero vision and just reasons not to.

    Alabama sucked in football before Saban. Someone got fed up and they made a investment. 4 National Championships in 8 years. Spend money and shit happens.


  37. BigB, did you happen to see what Sandusky’s pension was .. as well as all the others who were connected to the scandal? They were all very well set up, but apparently will not lose anything (except for Sandusky) since the others may not even go to trial (seems to be forgotten.) I just read an article where the largest salaried state employee in most of the states was a college coach (no surprise there.)

    I agree with some of the above posters. A 50k stadium will be ideal but an Oakland setting would certainly to be … no room, no access. And yes, Bates St is a joke.


  38. imo, Patrick Gallagher is a very big upgrade as Chancellor of The University of Pittsburgh considering PITT football and it shouldn’t be downplayed. He gets it. College football can generate money like a solid investment.


  39. How can you say Alabama sucked before Saban? They have certainly risen to the upper echelon under him, but they’ve had success throughout the last 40 years. Pre-Saban, they won at least 10 games in 2005, 2002, 1999, 1996, 1994, 1992, 1991, 1989, 1986, 1980, 1979, 1978, and 1977 (and three national championships between our last national title and Saban).


  40. from wiki … Bryant coached at Alabama for 25 years, winning six national titles (1961, 1964, 1965, 1973, 1978, and 1979) and thirteen SEC championships. Bryant’s win over in-state rival Auburn University, coached by former Bryant assistant Pat Dye on November 28, 1981 was Bryant’s 315th as a head coach, which was the most of any head coach at that time.

    And I bet the boosters didn’t even buy him a house (maybe they did)


  41. Gallagher hired Barnes Major F up Move.

    I watched Bama before Saban. Shula coached them and sucked. They didn’t even make bowl games. They committed is my point.

    Here’s a note…. 2/3’s of Oakland is Slum Housing. Buy it all and buy a stadium. Easy Peasy. Tear down the JV Olympic Sports complex they built. High Schools in Texas have nicer facilities than that Petserson Complex Joke.

    Liked by 1 person

  42. I am hoping that Congress passes the infrastructure bill soon where developers get a tax break to build stuff like stadiums and toll roads and they get the money from them. It may help to fund a possible OCS. Pitt should keep an eye on this and be ready as other cities will be ready.


  43. wwb…Yep, Sandusky and others were or are in line for some major retirement money..Didnt I read where Pa has major financial issues funding the state retirement program?
    UPitt- I had my most severe vertigo attack in 3 years last night..did my maneuvers but have felt like crap all day…


  44. JoeKnew — re: your post above about Hazelwood being an inappropriate site for an OCS — there are serious discussions going on in the City about putting a light-rail link (going through Panther Hollow and “The Run”) which would link Pitt and CMU with the high-tech endeavors down along the river. Probably a five minute trip. Buses could get you downtown via 2nd avenue in ten. Should be plenty of land left for parking. An OCS would fit in nicely.


  45. Kennametal was all set to build a big campus/headquarters down there at Hazelwood until they experienced some losses the past couple years. It’s the best available location for a stadium which I still think is possible in the next 15 years. Schenley is obviously the best local.


  46. SOP is saying that winning your bowl game, or any other game, does not matter…Losing always matters when the object of the game is to win


  47. Hold on again. Can we all look back and reread where anyone said it didn’t matter losing the bowl-game?

    My point is that many positives were gleaned from this past season and focusing on the one loss is a disservice to the football team….imo…


  48. Pete, That’s great for the 5k students coming from Oakland. But other than on campus students who else will come from Oakland. Buses on 2nd ave, lmao. Have you been on that street during rush hour. This isn’t 1932, people unfortunately want to drive everywhere. You can’t get 4K students to take busses to games, who u gonna get 25k fans? Sounds like more Pedudo bike lane shit to me.


  49. Back to the Future….

    For IMMEDIATE Release

    January 10, 2017

    Chancellor Gallagher Names Dr. Randy Juhl Pitt Acting Athletic Director

    PITTSBURGH—University of Pittsburgh Chancellor Patrick Gallagher announced today transition plans for Pitt’s athletic department, including the appointment of Dr. Randy Juhl as acting athletic director.
    Juhl, retired Vice Chancellor and Dean Emeritus of Pharmacy, will assume this role on January 20. He will be supported by outgoing athletic director Scott Barnes through February 12, when Barnes’ Pitt tenure will officially conclude.
    Juhl is very familiar with the role, having served as Pitt’s acting athletic director in 2015. He also will again chair the search committee that will recommend candidates for Pitt’s athletic director post.
    “I have asked Randy to resume this role in order to minimize disruption within our athletic department and facilitate coordination with the ongoing search process for our next athletic director,” Chancellor Gallagher said. “I am deeply grateful that he has agreed to come out of retirement to resume a pair of roles that he successfully carried out for us two years ago.
     “With Randy as our acting athletic director, we will continue to move forward with our strategic plan. Our shared goal is to maintain our outstanding momentum in advancing Pitt Athletics.”


  50. Pitt is Mediocre or Average if…
    It hires cheaply
    It doesnt invest in facilities
    It doesnt see how athletics contributes to the brand
    It accepts 6-6 football seasons and bowl games in Birmingham
    It doesnt make a splash hire for OC or AD

    I have no confidence in Pitt’s admin. It this were Parliament, it would be dissolved.


  51. To begin with, I make no apologies for my POV. As Reed requests, “don’t hold back” and I won’t. 1st off, I call BS on you Reed for the entire premise of this article. Bullshit on what is defined as average by you, bullshit on calling this season average, bullshit on implying that engaged Pitt fans are accepting of average results and bullshit on SOP still being discussed as it relates to this current team & their coaches.

    In two seasons Narduzzi has transformed this program. Anybody who has eyes and a brain who have observed the last two seasons and can’t appreciate the progress is a moron. Three seasons of HCPC WAS average. A 19-20 three year W-L record, with only one win in three bowls is “average”. Chryst’s recruiting was average. The team played and conducted themselves as average. That’s exactly what we got for those years. And you know what, after the shit storm that was the Wannstedt firing the Haywood domestic abuse scandal & firing plus the Fraud Graham debacle, average felt pretty damn stable and acceptable. That was then. This is now!

    Pat Narduzzi has not gotten the credit he is due, IMO. It’s been a “show me first” attitude by the fans, the media & guys like Reed, all along the way. Show me you can coach, show me you can recruit, show me you can win, then maybe I’ll demonstrate some support for the program, maybe. I call bullshit on that shitty fan attitude as well. Shame on us! The only SOP around here is the Same Old shitty attitude from so called Pitt fans. Shame on us!

    16-10 over two seasons is NOT average results for a guy who has NEVER been a HC before in his career and who was using a roster full of MAC type quality recruits to get the job done on the field in the first place. If we were something like 12-14, after losing to Northwestern, then OK, ask that question if we are just going to keep accepting “average” but give me a frickin break. This year we beat our arch rival, Penn State in a rocking filled to capacity Heinz Field then go beat Clemson, the “National Champion Clemson Tigers” IN DEATH VALLEY and you want to have us believe that this season was average?

    A Pitt team that broke the all time Pitt scoring record this year, led by a player that could have just as easily been on his death bed as of today rather than preparing for the NFL draft if his treatments had not been successful in defeating his cancer. The same individual who played so well after coming back from such a dire diagnosis to grab the ACC all-time TD record for the Conference. The same guy who has garnered more than one national award for his superior winning attitude. This is a team that, combined with Syracuse’s efforts, produced the highest scoring football game in the history of college football EVER! Spoiler Alert: THAT AIN’T AVERAGE!

    Yeah, this was an average year for the Panthers.

    Then we look at what the future holds. This coaching staff is once again on the verge of bringing in another really good recruiting class. Paris Ford is in this group. Max Browne came out of no where to reinforce the QB position and who knows what the eleventh hour holds for us in this class yet. I won’t be the least bit surprised to see 2 or 3 surprises show up before LOI signing day, just like last year. Remember when both Watt’s & Camp came out of the woodwork at the last moment to reinforce the very thin DL depth sheet? And Aaron Mathews gets flipped from Penn State too, right at the end before signing day. Narduzzi is not accepting average on the recruiting trail, I’ll guarantee you that. Our recruits now come from the recruiting hotbeds of Florida and the west coast and their offer sheets are littered with other Power 5 offers, not Mac type offer sheets like Chryst recruits were.

    So just stop it. Yes, the bowl game was important, extremely important to win IMO. However we didn’t get it done. No excuses. We made way to many mistakes, unforced errors. Slips, dropped TD passes, fumbles, key interceptions & injuries to key players. When you have that happen, you’re going to lose the football game more times than not and that’s what happened. No excuses, learn from it, use it as motivation to get better, turn the page and move on!

    The future is what we make it. Right now what we should all be asking ourselves as fans is how can I make it better for Pitt. May I suggest first that you decide to go to a couple home games this season. Second, change your attitudes, & lastly spend less time wishing for an OCS. Get with this Narduzzi Era it’s going places, with or without you. Make up your mind to get on board.


  52. Here’s a quote from acting AD Randy Juhl…”If Pitt can help cure polio and invent CPR, it sure as hell can win 10 football games”

    Don’t be scared my fellow PITT brothers, I will show you the way….


  53. Sorry Doc I missed your comment which is spot on. wtf is SOP about this past season? Nothing. Thank you for your post. I agree

    According to almost every blogger here, PITT out accomplished all preseason expectations yet somehow the PITT football team is practically being projected as failures. I don’t get it either…..ike


  54. @ Dr. Tom …. Bravo!!! 🙂

    @ Reed you seem to not comprehend that this is a process and not just instantaneous, snap-of-Narduzzi’s-finger and poof!! —- The roster is filled with 85 players — RS Senior to incoming Freshman recruit — of his players!

    Narduzzi won so far with all Chryst and even Graham guys —> and he has still been using all the available scholarships to bring in his Own Recruits into the program, and all these recruits are just Pups right now.

    Biggest thing @Reed is that I feel your not seeing the “Big Picture” here, in that these 18 and 19 year olds Narduzzi has brought in so far can’t just come in immediately, snap! — and be bigger, stronger, and have the experience of the untalented 22 and 23 year old Chryst guys who are playing. The youngin’s may already by 10-times faster and more explosive — but they all need to eat 4,000 calories a day and lift and train for Big Time Football. That takes time! And Narduzzi will bring in 25 athletes again this recruiting class so it is happening — you just have to have a little faith @Reed!

    NOW — if in the 2017 and 2018 seasons (this upcoming year and the next), Pitt Football meanders to 8-4 similarly to the last two years — with teams that may be young, but are now all “Narduzzi’s Players” starting at every spot, your view will become very Relevant and Appropriate.


  55. Lol and @Reed —- Pitt beat Clemson Head-To-Head with them at Full-Strength and all of their players healthy including all their Stars and Captains — At Their Place.

    Honestly I also think a Pure Pitt stadium — to ever make it Pitt would have to tear-down tons of Pitt recreational buildings (Trees Hall, Fitzgerald Field House, all that stuff up there — dang haven’t been on campus for a few years now yikes memories!) — they’d have to tear down alllll of that — then consildate it all into a new Huge Pitt “Sports Complex” in the New Stadium

    It’s very possible it’s just Such a HUGE undertaking that would mess things up for the students on campus during all the building processes.

    Pitt would have to build a minimum 50,000 person capacity stadium ( all seats — no cheap garbage bleachers be classy ) that could accomidate a few thousand more up to 55,000 hopefully for big games.

    I like Heinz though — and I think if they just made some big, Beautiful Pitt Script Tarps and ‘adorned’ the upper deckes with them during games (to almost make it look like a nice design of the stadium) then there would no longer ever be an “empty seats issue” anymore. Scott Barnes did not make this happen lol.


  56. Here, Here Dr. Tom! Love the passion! If you and Upitt are the extremes on the state of Pitt FB with the rest of us POVers in the middle, I definitely skew to the Team Tom/DK side. H2P !


  57. If you can cure polio youncan build a stadium on or near a campus. There is zero chance Pitt becomes anything more than a flash in the pan playing at Heinz.


  58. If you guys want only puppies and rainbows not saying you do the. Read that non athlete tool Dokish. Homer of the year.


  59. Beating Clemson is like banging the hottest chick ever because the stars aligned. She had a few drinks, broke up with her boyfriend, barry white was playing. You were looking good that day and just got a haircut and had a nice tan. The stars aligned if you get my drift. That is okay but I think it gives many of you guys false hope. We then get smacked against a shitty NW Team. We are who we are. Win the ones we are supposed to mostly. Lose the ones we are supposed to mostly and occasionally lose one we should win and win one we shouldnt. That is 7/8 wins max.

    The next day we are the same not tanned no good game hotmess and she is back with her boyfriend. But man it was nice while you were with her. But, alas it is just a memory.

    Build a stadium on campus and get actual suport and pride in Pitt and watxh what happens. If not in 5 years after 7 wins we will say remember we beat Clemson.


  60. @Upittbaseball

    To build a Pitt Stadium that’s really on-campus, Pitt is not going to buy-out residential areas and tear it down / Schenley Park and so-forth (South Oakland / lol anyone remember awesome-dreamers talked about “Panther Hollow”?? lol).

    Can Pitt feasibly build a say, 52,500 seat stadium (all seats no bleachers — don’t downgrade lol) with all the “Fixins” on the Southside?? I have zero clue about the feasibility of that.

    Otherwise building a stadium anywhere else seems pointless because it would be farther away than Heinz is!

    If Pitt builds any on-campus stadium they would have to make Consolidations and Big Decisions with current buildings like they did by tearing down the Pitt Stadium to Build the Pete — a new Pitt stadium seems like it would require tearing-down the old, and consildating it all in the new.

    I say just make sweet-A$$ Pitt Script Tarps for the upper decks that look awesome dang is it that hard??!

    How about they spend some money (not joking here), and literally order 68,000 Pitt Colored (Navy Blue and yellow or that new Throwback colors) seat covers for the Heinz seats — and before every home game they hire people to just cover each available (not pitt script tarped covered) seat with these covers so that on TV and in person the whole stadium appears Pitt Colored (sans the Ketchup bottle lol)???

    Barnes really I think was kind of Lazy and lacked Inspiration and imagination —- He very easily could have taken initiative and made a lot of Stuff happen to Make Heinz Pure-Pitt in Color, Design, and Atmosphere on Gameday. —- Lol If I ever met him he’s say I’m giving him a Migrane ……. Too Much NOISE!!! haha


  61. Has anyone ever been to UGa stadium in Athens?

    It is a big stadium and I’m sure it was built first then buildings built around it but you have to wonder how in heck did they do that. It’s really tucked into the campus and there are a lot of surrounding hills and elevations.

    I have been to a lot of college football games since 1967 all over this country and nothing beats an on campus stadium.

    Sorry but Heinz sucks, no atmosphere, off campus and a tarped Heinz field is laughable.

    Steve Peterson killed us by moving and guess what Cas Mylinski was pressured into moving Pitt to 3 Rivers and said NO!

    I agree with UPitt above.


  62. Upitt, PITT did beat Clemson and then beat ACC opponents Duke and Syracuse. I was told all year that the psu win didn’t mean as much as ACC games. PITT can win for nothing with their fans….


  63. Now I’ve seen it all. Upittbaseball can actually spin getting laid by a hot chick as a bad thing!


    Take deep breath


    I’m weak!


  64. Doc – LOL. Can’t wait for dinner.

    It is the peak for the avg man or team was my point.

    Ike – Syracuse sucks and so does Duke in Football. Is that news???


  65. Isn’t it a slap in the nuts that Randy Juhl (isn’t he a pharmacist?) the acting AD instead of, uh, someone who ACTUALLY WORKS IN THE ATHLETIC DEPARTMENT.


  66. Dakie that bought 15 houses on Oakland Ave for those dorms. They tore down my place.

    Tore down the shitty projects for a shitty olympic sports complex.


  67. You know the Cost Center, Fitzgerald Field, Trees Hall. Pitt owns all of it. Thats where the fucker will be dropped. SMPC and more. Feasibility already being done.


  68. Landing in Lauderdale. We playing hoods tonight????? Brissel Billy Stallings will probably get smoked. The Noise is tslking Herman head. Great hire you turd.


  69. Upitt 8 drinks would not have given Johnny a buzz. A friend was at a frat party in the 70’s when Majors showed up with Lee Majors the Six Million Dollar Man – Johnny toured the frat houses to drum up interest in going to games. Lee Majors, drinking glass to glass with Johnny fell down a flight of stairs ass over heels. Like a good Reb Johnny walked steadily down the stairs and picked Lee off the floor.

    Averageness ie mediocrity. However I like the new word and maybe in a few years it will join jagoff in Webster’s.

    Have many thoughts on OCS and am thinking of sending Reed an article at end of February so, if it passes muster y’all can tear me apart. it includes me being the first prosecutor in Pa and probably country taking over a church and its day care center paying off swindled parishoners 1 million and fighting racism in the process. Dare to dream, think outside the box, make it happen.

    We (me included) complained about Barnes staying on the job and deciding who was the right fit for a new AD. This was in today’s Post Gazette ( if linked yesterday my apologies) but POV talks Pitt llistens. Randy Juhl new interim AD. Barnes part time.

    Rumor has it that the city now has rights to Oakland VA and will build a city/county police training center there. Y’all at Pitt asleep? OCS? city and county have numerous properties that could be used for a training center..


  70. JoeKnew — “Have you been on that street during rush hour?” Memo to Joe: Pitt games are not played during weekday rush hours. Thought you might know about that. What Country do you live in?


  71. Sam Houston: Bruce Feldman of FoxSports reports former Nevada OC Tim Cramsey will be the new OC at Sam Houston.

    Pittsburgh: The search continues to find a replacement for former OC Matt Canada.


  72. The Pitt BB team is doing a great job of helping Pitt fans forget how bad the 2016 defensive unit really was.

    Go figure…


  73. ike – you mentioned earlier today that Pitt FB exceeded most everyone’s expectations this past season.

    I was on record before the nova game “expecting” a 10-2 regular season record. I was one of the disappointed (way back at the VATech game).

    Pitt did beat the pedos – that satisfied and eased the pain of the other losses.


  74. Pete, if you don’t know the point I was trying to make with that statement then you are truly clueless. Second Ave and the grid around that area cannot handle the volume on a game day, any urban planner or transportation engineer will tell you that. Don’t get all pissy.


  75. Good for you EE. You were certainly not one of the most. Dr Tom is looking to sign you up for the PITT optimistic fan club! We see the glass as half full.


  76. As reported by Andrea Adelson of ESPN –

    Most disappointing end to a season: Pittsburgh. The Panthers went into the New Era Pinstripe Bowl ranked No. 23, with wins over Clemson and Penn State. But with a chance to win more than eight games for the first time since 2009, Pitt came up short against Northwestern. Its record-setting offense stalled after James Conner and Nathan Peterman both got hurt (starting guard Dorian Johnson also was injured), and the usually stout run defense couldn’t slow down Justin Jackson (224 yards, 3 TDs).


  77. Nebraska: Sources tell FootballScoop Mike Riley has decided that he will not renew the contract of defensive coordinator Mark Banker.


  78. I totally agree with Reed that the loss to Northwestern had a much larger impact than most Pitt fans realize. Lots of momentum lost. Potential negative impact on recruiting. ACC as a whole being lauded at this point, and we moved towards back of the train.

    Also as Reed pointed out, and as I’ve stated here before: the attendance at the Duke game following the Clemson win was an embarrassment. It shows why we may never return to national prominence on a regular basis. No school (except Miami years ago) can be consistently competitive nationally when drawing 35,000 fans per game on average.


  79. I agree that the loss was just as painful almost as the NC loss. It’s about capitalizing on opportunities. We battle with the kids we have. I don’t think this negatively impacts recruiting, but I do think we could have done better at recruiting had we won the game.


  80. So, I’m a Pitt fan!? Shoot me. I know what we can be, and I might live long enough to see it again. Play ten seasons with a team and coaching like we had this year, we’re in the top 10 two or three times, and in the final 3 once. We’d also be 5 and 7 once, so 8-5 while really disappointing given what might have been (VT and UNC really hurt, and NW was the worst loss of all), it’s OK and not “average.” And we will get better.

    Bowl games matter. The Rose Bowl was terrific. The playoff is so overhyped.


  81. Pulled this from PSN –

    This weekend (official visit) will not answer all of Butler’s questions, though. One thing does disappoint Dontavius heading into his visit, although he will not allow it to ruin his weekend.

    “I wish I could meet the offensive coordinator, but obviously he’s not there,” he confesses. “So I’m looking forward to spending time with Coach Narduzzi, coach Salem, Coach Sherman, and just meeting everyone else on the staff.”


  82. UConn: Auburn offensive coordinator / quarterbacks coach Rhett Lashlee has joined the UConn staff as offensive coordinator. Lashlee has been at Auburn since 2013 and took over offensive play-calling this season. UConn athletic director David Benedict previously worked at Auburn. ESPN’s Brett McMurphy reports Lashlee will have a 3-year deal worth $350,000 annually.

    Pittsburgh: The big fish of an offensive coordinator that Pitt is trying to reel in, sure is taking a lot of time to get in the boat. Must be really BIG…


  83. The recruiting dead period just ended yesterday, so it is time for the Pitt coaches to get very active over the next 2-1/2 weeks, minus the OC.

    To finish strong and top 25 we will need to hang on to P.Ford and T.Sibley, plus flip someone else’s recruit or two. JMO…


  84. Narduzzi has clearly failed on this OC search. My guess is that he has been burned twice by Chaney and Canada and he is very gun shy about hiring anyone that’s not likely to stick to the program for multiple years. By the way the search is going he may end what with a “Conklin like OC” with the end result being Pitt being a dismal failure on both the offense and defense in the coming year.—I know Narduzzi has only been here for two years, but has he fired any assistant coaches as of yet? He certainly has ample grounds to do so on the defensive side IMHO.


  85. jrnpitt – I hope we are both pleasantly surprised. And the answer to you question on whether HCPN has fired any coaches in his short 2 years at Pitt – no, unless you include Chaney.


  86. I wouldn’t say Pitt failed with Canada. If you could make a del where the team sets records on offense but you’d only have the coach for one year, I think you’d take it and hope that the success wold help make it easier to hire the next OC…although I’d probably trade a couple fewer points per game for multi year stability .


  87. I’m assuming the AD cluster has slowed the OC hire situation . .can’t imagine why else it has taken so long. Job should be attractive to an up and comer seeing what Pitt has coming back and how the job benefitted Canada.


  88. Would it be better if Pitt when down a notch to D1-AA and be a big fish versus 8-4 to 5-7 range we have been in for 30 years?


  89. Pitt in Tampa – simple answer is NO.

    UPitt – are you quoting a legitimate source? There are numerous decent candidates left – unfortunately, the recruiting dead period ended yesterday and we have 2-1/2 weeks to close some deals with NO OC.

    If Enos truly did turn Pitt down, he was done with his season two weeks ago –


  90. To say HCPN has failed in his search for an OC before one is actually hired is typical Pitt fan cynicism … always seeing the the glass half empty. After 4 years of .500 ball, we have back to back 8 win season .. INCLUDING PLAYING TWO TOP 10 OUT OF CONFERENCE TEAMS IN ‘BOTH’ SEASONS … and you would think we are Rutgers by reading these comments.

    and BTW, we looked bad in the bowl game last year but still closed the recruiting period with a flourish .. Camp and Mathews were last week additions to name just a few.

    Now who knows what will happen with recruiting and the new OC in the nest few weeks, but who in the hell are we as Pitt fans to act like we are privileged …. we with the 25,000 empty seats just about every freakin’ game. WISE UP AHOLES!!

    Liked by 2 people

  91. Sources said 5-6 days ago he told them no. Money probably was part of it as was him wanting a better job. Probably wanting in pro ball. If that doesnt come he stays at Arkansas.


  92. There may be a lot of reasons that nobody has come to Pitt as the offensive coordinator so far and one of them is that it’s a pretty hard act to follow from Canada and his 2016 season.

    But another factor could also be the head coach himself. I don’t think he’s the easiest person to get along with and I know for a fact that the offensive coordinator of last year Chaney, couldn’t get out of the Southside fast enough.

    Plus the coordinator budget is probably not all that high.


  93. wwb – I won’t take offense to the name calling – I am attempting to wise up and am considering whether to renew my season tickets (plural) and donations.

    I was doing the same thing last year after the BAD bowl game loss – Conner help the decision to stay positive.

    Again, BAD bowl loss to end the season – what could possibly change my mind this year? Certainly not you…


  94. Here is how Pitt closed last year AFTER the bowl game (RIVALS ratings)

    Name Pos Location Ht Wt Signed Rating Committed
    Rashad Weaver DE Cooper City, FL 6’5″ 245 5.4 2/3/16
    Keyshon Camp DT Lakeland, FL 6’3″ 274 5.7 2/3/16
    Damar Hamlin DB Pittsburgh, PA 6’1″ 179 5.9 2/2/16
    Aaron Mathews ATH Clairton, PA 6’4″ 188 5.6 2/2/16
    Amir Watts DT Chicago, IL 6’3″ 275 5.8 1/25/16
    Elias Reynolds LB Brooklyn, NY 6’2″ 227 5.3 1/24/16


  95. ERIE, while it is certainly your right to not renew your tickets … if you do not renew, you are only adding to the problem. In fact, you are the problem .. and I can’t emphasize that enough.

    Don’t get me wrong, I have been averaging just 3 games per year … but at least I don’t bitch and moan at every little thing …. and above all, I don’t have unrealistic expectations for a program that has a large handful of issues, some of the important ones being out of their control


  96. Do you think that if OSU and PSU had 1/3 the numbers of alums that they do have, and played in a city with a successful NFL team, that they would draw > 90k every game … and recruit as well as they do … and rake in the income that they do.etc?

    Quit comparing us to these programs … it is unfair


  97. Rkb — I’m pretty sure that city/county police training center is not planned to be built at the Oakland VA next to Pitt’s campus, but at an old VA facility site in or near Homewood. As far as I am aware, there are no plans to replace the Oakland VA hospital.

    With respect to accessibility of an OCS, it does seem that Pitt plays a game a year on Thursday night (it was the home game against VT this year), so there actually is a concern about fighting rush hour traffic to get to a game — either that or someone needs to push for different scheduling.


  98. Look around..

    Fedora just finished his fifth year at UNC, and had a QB, RB and 2 receivers declare for the NFL draft early .. and had 5 losses.

    Ok St, who we lost to by 7 at their place, beat the then 10th ranked team in their bowl game, 38 to 8. WVU finished 18th ranked yet was 0 and 3 vs the top 25, outscored by 162 to 40 in those games. We were 2 and 3 vs Top 25.. Miami finished at 20th in the rankings, 2 slots behind WVU … yet trounced them in the bowl game.

    Quit expecting an overnight sensation … we don;t have the means for that. Yes, we can always do better but for us not to appreciate progress is silly.

    Liked by 1 person

  99. There may be a lot of reasons that nobody has come to Pitt as the offensive coordinator so far and one of them is that it’s a pretty hard act to follow from Canada and his 2016 season.

    — If a coach thinks like this, then we certainly don’t want a guy like that on Narduzzi’s staff.

    But another factor could also be the head coach himself. I don’t think he’s the easiest person to get along with and I know for a fact that the offensive coordinator of last year Chaney, couldn’t get out of the Southside fast enough.

    — Chaney was average and the results at Georgia in 2016 proved it. The door was held open for him to leave and we should be thankful he left.

    Plus the coordinator budget is probably not all that high.

    — Different times at Pitt now. Basketball is being ignored and football emphasized. Canada’s offer reached $1 million.


  100. wwb – I was in school with Marino. I’ve waited a long time – I have contributed and been through some really lean years.

    The trip to Pitt home games is 4+ hours – one way. I was at all of them but one or two for the past ten years – your crawling on the wrong guy – by the way, your not invited to the POV Spring golf outing…


  101. Erie, so let me get this straight … you have been to almost every home game the last 10 years, through all of the turmoil, etc …. and now you are considering not attending any more after two straight 8 win season versus a very credible schedule?


  102. one final entry, Erie. My initial post this morning at 7:42 am was not intended specifically for you but instead to all of the cynicism I am reading on this site. But since you took it so personally, I guess it was for you.


  103. You all do realize Chaney and Canada were announce around this time when hired. It is not taking longer than usual. I think Chaney was January 15th.

    Typical SOP fans making up negative shit to bitch about. Jesus, do you all roll out of bed in the morning and start fucking complaining.

    Liked by 1 person

  104. Guys, I think it must be the winter doldrums settling in, we are getting a bit chippy. No need for anyone to justify there POV. I have always had a back of the mind feeling about Narduzzi, but will attend every home game no matter who is the coach or what the record. I just like going!
    To clarify a previous post, the heavy traffic during rush hour is similar to that of a game day crowd. It overwealms the grid. The Hot metal bridge is a narrow 2 lane which backs up at all times of the day. Don’t know of any river transportation that would be economically feasible from downtown. The SH tunnels back traffic up at any time of day, seldom have I come from Monroeville direction and not been backed up, weekends included. Trains have been tried and failed. Traveling thru the Southsde has always been a nightmare,again, any time of day. Light rail would have to be massive to transport needed volume, and park and rides would need to be established.
    Where the light rail exists(south hills) it is used but becomes easily overwealmed. We in Pittsburgh actually live in a 3rd world country transportation wise. The simple fact of the matter is that most people want to drive to games, Steelers, Pens, Pirates. Parking becomes a challenge, with most people having “secret” spots. So please, go to that area anytime traffic is “moderate” and come up with a reasonable, realistic, alternative route. I’d follow it, but you’d probably keep it a secret!


  105. with the key injuries incurred during the game, I think we should have lost to Northwestern …. and I believe this with every fiber of my being.

    Two of the top defensive players: one DNP, the other just 2 series
    Our star RB missed the entire 2nd half
    Our A-A OG and starting QB in the 3rd quarter after we finally

    And we still retook the lead early in the 4th after all of that .. and turnovers from reliable sources


  106. Seems like we are all a little cranky this morning. Probably a function of being stuck inside for too long.

    We will get an OC soon. My bet is within the next week. Of course, I am totally guessing.

    Erie—Where and when is the “golf outing”? I will be happy to ride with wwb. Maybe a foursome with Dr Tom and BigB.

    Upitt—Do you play golf? You would be a treat to have along for commentary on my poor play.



  107. LOL — Pitt offered Matt Canada a cool Million / year or more to stay — so “Cheap” is no longer an issue. The Chancellor had to OK that, so that is now a ‘Precedent’.

    It’s probably Alex Van Pelt as the new O.C. — the man who’s a Pitt Legacy and who has helped Aaron Rodgers play the best QB play in the history of football. That’s happening right now in the Playoffs.

    LOL — I read comments about, “Pat Narduzzi being Gun-Shy because of Chaney and Canada”, and what-not….. Wow, NO, Pat Narduzzi ain’t “Gun-Shy” ever, he is not that person my goodness, lol.

    Alex Van Pelt did call the offensive plays on two separate interem NFL occasions when the Offensive Coordinator was fired, and he did as well as could ever be expected. Gotta do some research (i.e. 20 second google search and, Pow — Stats, Seasons, etc. all there 🙂 ).

    Alex Van Pelt is the Man I Hope 🙂 — as possibly evidenced by Narduzzi not bringing in any other potential OC prospect as of yet, even after Chancellor Gallagher showed that he will pay up to a Mil / year for a top Coordinator.


  108. pmdH2P – the golf outing will be sometime around the Spring game – mid-April at Quicksilver Golf Club near the Pittsburgh Airport.

    Arrangements are in process – UPitt has 2 foursomes reserved (for golf).


  109. Chaney couldn’t get out of the southside fast enough for Narduzzi’s liking. and mine either for that matter.

    I really was expecting the hiring of an OC late this week and it can still happen.

    Juhl is a competent acting AD along with EJ who suddenly you hear nothing about. I had heard he really didn’t want the job. I wonder if that’s true? Back to Juhl, he really wants PITT to field a very competitive football team and he will find a great AD eventually. imo

    Ever since REED ask us to calm down with the expletives I seem to be reading more of them…go ffffffffffffff figure


  110. FWIW … I hung up my golf clubs 5 years ago after my game became embarrassingly bad (think Rutgers’ FB.) I used to be a bogie golfer, now it would be a miracle if I came close to breaking 100.

    I remember playing Quicksilver about 15 years ago .. long and hilly. A really good course (used to be a Senior PGA Tour stop) but more importantly, it has a very nice 19th hole as I recall.


  111. All you guys still clamoring for an OCS, you do realize that virtually to a man the incoming recruits cite playing and practicing where the Steelers do is a big attraction for them. You guys just got to get over it. An OCS ain’t happening. Accept Heinz for what it is, and I say this as a season ticket holder for most of the past 30 years.


  112. The Bowl game was the first under Narduzzi where Pitt beat themselves and could not make plays in the red zone. Then the two concussions to our two offensive MVPs. Yes it hurt, but should not be looked at as a measuring stick for the program.

    The measuring stick is 8 wins, including PSU and Clemson, and against one of the toughest schedules in D-1. The program is heading in the right direction. It won’t be a straight line and there are always bumps in the road.

    Narduzzi needs to finish this recruiting class with some difference makers, especially on the D-line, to keep that momentum heading upward.

    They talked about how Alabama has had five OC’s under Sabin, It is obviously the players that win games.

    Our two OC’s left for Georgia and LSU. We all said good riddance to Chaney. Canada got a great raise and a platform from which he can make his next move to head coach.


  113. I believe before Quicksilver it was called Falling Timbers or something like that. The Seniors used to play there but decided not to anymore because it was too difficult for them. A challenging track for those that don’t hit too long as well as some significant rough as I recall.


  114. How tough was our schedule? Second game vs PSU then on the road vs OKST, on the road vs UNC, A Thursday night game (never attended well) vs VT, Miami on the road and Clemson on the road. All the toughest ACC games on the road or on Thursday night. The easy ACC games GT, Duke, Syracuse at home.

    Eight wins was amazing.


  115. Darkie – They offered him 1M after he had a 1.4M deal
    LSU. They are still cheap and not proactive. Give me more money after I got a new offer is bush league. Barnes was busy cutting his own deal. Terrible Admin. Canada was more important than Tweetduzzi.


  116. But we would rather whine about Heinz Field and how long it is taking to find an OC.

    Our fans are what is less than average. Not all, a great turn out by the faithful in NYC.


  117. One rumor being Enos may have turn down the job but I think he had just had his contract renegotiated just last year.

    2 other names being thrown about Billy Napier and Streeter.


  118. OK, Ok, I see the light……….
    Winning the bowl game and closing the season 9-4 on an upswing and being ranked between 15-18 in the country is CLEARLY NO BETTER than losing the bowl game, going 8-5 and ending outside the top 20 at 33!
    Thanks for straightening me out guys. What in the world was I thinking????????


  119. I miss Pitt Stadium as much as anyone, but Heinz is not all that bad. I have read some great ideas from previous posts to make it even better. Hopefully ‘the powers that be’ are reading also. I think an OCS would be a traffic & parking nightmare. We just need to get more butts in the seats at Heinz…period! Then let’s talk OCS.

    As a die-hard fan, I think this season was a success. A couple plays here & there and we could have been Top 10…a couple plays here & there and we could have had a .500 season! An 8-5 season is better than 6-7. Now with 2 decent seasons in a row, we as fans want more…that’s just human nature. Our expectations are now higher. Is it that ridiculous as Pitt fans to expect 10 or 11 wins the next couple seasons? How about an ACC championship? How about the playoffs? I want to see another National Championship before I die…am I being unrealistic? No…I am a lifelong, die-hard Pitt fan who remembers the ‘glory days’! I expect the best & will not settle for ‘averageness’. We have all been waiting a long time for our return to glory, we don’t just want to be ‘teased’ with a couple above average seasons! We could have been 14-0, lose to Alabama on a last second field goal, and still hear about ‘SOP’…that’s just the way it is. That’s what 30 years of suffering will do to you as a Pitt fan.

    Thanks for reading! Hail to PITT!


  120. UPitt a guy that throws his arm out in college is just an old frustrated athlete. Someone that should know how tough it is to succeed in sports. I hope your world view is not as negative as your opinion of your alma mater. Not sure how you get up in the morning with all the darkness. From my experience, guys that bitch and moan and whine all the time rarely accomplish much.


  121. Pittman4, I consider you re a great contributor at POV like all the guys and gal here…but again, I don’t think anyone has said they didn’t want PITT to win the bowl game. It’s all the negative comments that followed the loss, making it sound like the entire season as a whole became a failure over the one loss…I guess we all see things differently even with people we often agree with..


  122. Altoona – well said.

    Dabo Sweeney said after the NC game that attitude, not money is how you change your FB culture into a winner.

    I believe HCPN is on the right track, but losing the bowl games is NOT acceptable.

    I’m sorry if you disagree – you can cuss at me all you want – if Reed allows it…


  123. In sports you sometimes win an upset and sometimes you lose. That is why they play the games.

    We were the only one to upset Clemson was that acceptable?

    NW was not chopped liver. We played a poor game and suffered devastating injuries. It happens.

    NW won 10 games the year before and played tough in all their games this year.

    They have a great coach, good QB, Receiver and running back, also a solid defense. Their lines were good. They made fewer mistakes than we did.


  124. Saying the NW loss is unacceptable is what I’m talking about. How and why is that true? Not being a smartypants, I just want to know.


  125. Erie, Glad things worked out at Quicksilver. Nice course, lots of parking, great clubhouse and nice staff. Never give advice on the course, but a pre outing warning: keep the ball BELOW the hole on 1-4. If not you WILL 3 putt at least! Oh, I don’t think they have a cart girl, but I can ask Karl if you want. Maybe it could be a medication cart with Upitt and Darkie (if he gets a weekend pass) lol


  126. Narduzzi has us on the right path. I think he is changing the culture & the attitude.

    The stakes were pretty high going in to the bowl game…A chance to get to 9 wins, a top 20 (maybe top 15) ranking, national respect, and a chance to beat a Big 10 team…and we crapped the bed! That was unacceptable to me. I know…a couple plays here & there, the injuries, etc! I was expecting them to win, and finish the season on a high note. But by no means does the bowl loss mean the season was a failure.


  127. I like Kevin Johns and Van Pelt. Either one works for me. The downside of offering $1M to O Canada after it was too late is that going forward, any candidate knows that the ceiling has gotten a little higher at Pitt. So if an OC was making $400k, they know they can ask for a big raise, which may put the HC in a quandry.

    Long suffering, you are a PItt fan loyalist because you got sucked into Pitt Football when you could see it on campus. You identified with Pitt because of it. Recruits have more interaction at the practice facility shared with the Steelers than at Heinz field. If anything, the opposing players get more hyped to play against us at Heinz, than we get for playing at Heinz. There is no home field advantage, sorry.

    If the Admin says no, so be it. I have told many a ceo that they are making strategic mistakes only to be told later, that I was right. Unfortunately I have also been told, that I was wrong. In the M&A world, the wins outnumbered the losses so far, so that is good. A 10 year OCS strategic plan addresses the shortcoming with our program and that is our own place to play. I never ask a ceo for a 10 year plan because most don’t last that long. That is why so many struggle with their vision and legacy. This comes down to Gallagher defining his legacy. He can be average and Pitt has accepted that….or, he can be a game changer. His call. He has more power than individual board members so he just needs to understand how to use it.


  128. The unacceptable part of Noel game losses is this:

    We do it most every year / loss to a mediocre team.

    That has to stop or when we do get to a New Year’s Day bowl, the coaches and players won’t know how to win and the fans will probably not show up –

    Practice winning for the future – it looks better and it is that simple.


  129. Pitt did crap the bed. You have to wonder how much knowing Canada was leaving affected the focus of the offense. Conner was awful, even before he went down. Aston has got in the end zone almost every time. Peterman throws a totally uncharacteristic redzone INT. Orndoff drops multiple passes. Henderson fumbles twice, loses one and ruins the opening drive with the other.

    And NW was a very good 6-6 team. Solid on both sides of the ball, unlike like our Jekyl/offense-Hyde/defense team.


  130. This year for the first time you could hear and see a Pitt fan presence at the away and bowl games. That is good! The lack of a good turnout at home games is the problem.I think that is a problem of being in a middle market city with a nationally supported NFL team. Back in the 80s when the NFL went on strike Pitt stadium was full every game until the strike ended. In 1957 Pitt opened against a top ranked Oklahoma and had standing room only while the Pirates had a full house 2 blocks away in Oakland. The Steelers still were not a dominant force in sports in Pittsburgh. We do not have the alum base of the big state Universities and have tough local comp. for the other sports fans. Also Penn State has 3 centers in the Pittsburgh area.We can only get fans with consistant excellence and national recognition. Which comes first the chicken or the egg.


  131. Altoona – I liked your 1225pm post. I’ll add my own thoughts. Its completely unrealistic to:

    expect that Pitt will be a perennial Top 10 program
    expect that an OCS will be built within the next 10 years
    expect that we will always win games we “are supposed to” (no upsets – ever!)
    expect that 65,000 fans will attend Pitt games on a regular basis

    Having said that, I think that we can reasonably and realistically expect Pitt FB to be “Above Averageness” in the following ways:

    consistent (i.e. 3 out of every 4 years) finish in the Top 25
    finish in the Top 20 half of that time (1-2 times every 4 years)
    finish in the Top 10 occasionally (once every 6-8 years)
    win the Coastal Division 1 in every 3-4 years
    have 40,000-45,000 in regular attendance after achieving the above for 2 more years

    We have certainly had our chances to pull ourselves out of averageness. Why we sh1t the bed when on the doorstep of Above Averageness is confounding. The past two bowls games are still fresh in everyone’s minds, but there are plenty of other inexplicable losses under different coaches….

    Marty Gilyard
    Two onside kick miscues in Ft. Worth
    Phantom PI call in South Bend
    Chryst running Voytik to the right late against Duke at home
    Two come from behind losses in Chapel Hill
    An insistence by Cavanaugh to call fade patterns in high winds at El Paso
    …..and so on

    We win those games above and we’d be standing on the verge of getting it on with Above Averageness. (with apologies to Parliament).


  132. The last time I played Quicksilver, I noted the course was in rougher shape than in the past. Anomaly?

    Given the opportunity, I’d rather play with the cheerleaders than the cynics. Golf is after all, a game of confidence. 🙂


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